Let’s look at the Martin/Zimmerman timeline.
First we have to audio clip that Mata provided for us.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9A-gp8mrdw[/youtube]
And the transcript is here
The official audio can be downloaded here.
To begin with, Zimmerman is in his vehicle (1) as he speaks with the dispatcher. At 0:56 of the clip
“That’s the clubhouse, do you know what the- he’s near the clubhouse right now?”
“Yeah, now he’s coming towards me.”
It does sound as though Martin (2) is walking in a direction away from the clubhouse, toward Zimmerman. Zimmerman says Martin is near the clubhouse, but Zimmerman does not say that he is near the clubhouse. The clubhouse is near the main entrance on Oregon St.
Zimmerman expressed concern that Martin might be carrying something as he approaches:
“He has his hands in his waistband. He is a black male. Something’s wrong with him. Yep. He’s coming to check me out. He’s got something in his hands. I don’t know what his deal is. Send officers over here.”
Zimmerman begins to give instructions as to his location when Martin begins to run and Zimmerman exclaims
“Shit, he’s running.”
At 2:10 of the audio recording, the vehicle door can be heard to open and at 2:14 it closes. By this time Martin has passed from near the clubhouse toward the area between the 13 and 28 buildings. Zimmerman begins to chase and you can hear the rustle of his clothing and his breathing at 2:19. The dispatcher ask if he is chasing Martin and Zimmerman acknowledges that he is. At 2:26 the dispatcher says:
“OK, we don’t need you to do that.”
Zimmerman says “OK” and the rustling ends at 2:42.
At 2:38 Zimmerman says “He ran” and apparently lost sight of Martin. Martin apparently escaped.
Zimmerman remains on the phone with the dispatcher until at least 4:12. During that time he describes his location and directs the dispatcher to the location of his parked car.
Zimmerman: If they come in through the gate, tell them to go straight past the club house, and uh, straight past the club house and make a left, and then they go past the mailboxes, that’s my truck…[unintelligible]
Dispatcher: What address are you parked in front of?
Zimmerman: I don’t know, it’s a cut through so I don’t know the address.
That puts Zimmerman’s vehicle on Twin Trees Lane. According to one report, near the bend. Martin apparently fled in between the 28 and 12 buildings toward his father’s girlfriend’s place, located near the back entrance of Twin Lakes. It is the direction Zimmerman described.
Dispatcher: “He’s running? Which way is he running?”
Zimmerman: “Down towards the other entrance to the neighborhood.”
Zimmerman’s phone call was received at 7:11:12. At 2:42 on the audio, Zimmerman stopped running and lost sight of Martin. That puts it at 7:13:54 or so. Zimmerman continues to speak to the dispatcher until at least 4:12 of the audio, or 7:15:24. It’s reported that the phone call to Brandy Green ended at 7:16. The fight and shooting took place between then and when the police arrived at 7:17.
This is the point the gaps exist.
Zimmerman is reportedly parked on Twin Trees Lane. He says Martin is coming toward him, and then he says Martin runs. Zimmerman says that Martin runs “towards the other entrance to the neighborhood.”(3) That is SE of Zimmerman’s position and it is in the direction of the home of Martin’s girlfriend. (4) Zimmerman begins chase, but then stands down when it was requested he do so and he apparently loses sight of Martin. The question is, which way did Martin run? If he ran down Twin Trees avoiding Zimmerman (5), Zimmerman could keep him in sight for some time. That would put Martin some distance from where the altercation occurred- in between 1321 and 2821, as described in the police report. (6) Martin was initially placed near the clubhouse. If he reversed course, say to head up to Retreat Circle (7), then Zimmerman would not have described him running toward the back entrance on South Oregon. If Martin ran toward the area in between buildings 28 and 12 passing near Zimmerman’s car and then turning the corner, Zimmerman would lose sight of him quickly.
This is all of significance because there was less than a minute in between the time Zimmerman ended the call to the police and the beginning of the altercation as the phone call from Martin to Green is said to have ended at 7:16 and Zimmerman was speaking to the dispatcher until 7:15:24. That’s about 30 seconds for Martin and Zimmerman to come together.
Zimmerman had no idea to where Martin was headed. Zimmerman did not catch Martin while Zimmerman was on the phone and Martin had a head start even if he only “walked fast” he still could outpace Zimmerman. Yet somehow they could not have been farther apart than about 30 seconds closure.
Then we come to some other questions. If Zimmerman was “hunting down” Martin as some have opined, why did he not simply shoot Martin upon encountering him? Why would Zimmerman get so close to Martin that Martin could punch Zimmerman in the face and knock him down if his intention was to kill Martin? (BTW, ABC News has had an epiphany. It has decided that George Zimmerman had injuries after all) Would a person bent on murder allow himself to be assaulted and still expect that he could reach and fire his gun? If Zimmerman was brandishing a gun what could possess Martin to attack him? No reasonable person is going to charge someone aiming a gun at one. Zimmerman agreed to meet with the police as they arrived. Why would he agree to meet them and then chase after Martin to kill him? Why would someone bent on murder hold Martin at gunpoint while he screamed for 40 seconds? Because he wanted witnesses to the murder? Why didn’t Zimmerman run if murder was the goal?
None of this makes any sense.
Now let’s consider what probably happened. Back to the NY Times
Soon, callers to 911 were describing the presence of police officers, and the beams of flashlights gliding over a section of grass a few dozen yards from Trayvon’s destination, where a boy inside was waiting for Skittles.
A few dozen yards. A few is about 3. Three dozen yards. 36-40 yards. 120 feet. George Zimmerman loses sight of Trayvon Martin at 2:38 of the call, or about 7:13:50. Martin has until 7:16 to cover the “few dozen yards” to make it to the safety of Brandy Green’s residence. Zimmerman remains on the phone until 7:15:24. Martin’s girlfriend said the phone call went “dead” at 7:16, but Martin and Zimmerman were already exchanging words. According to Martin’s girlfriend, the conversation was initiated by Martin. The window between the end of Zimmerman’s call to the SPD and the meeting is brief. Really brief.
Martin had over two minutes to reach Green residence. Why didn’t he go there? This suggests strongly that Martin did not go to the Green residence, but instead hid somewhere, waiting for Zimmerman, and then confronted Zimmerman. Martin spoke first to Zimmerman, not the other way around. I think Martin approached Zimmerman’s car from the direction of the clubhouse, passed the car and then bolted. Martin then rounded the corner and hid. Zimmerman pursued until being asked to stop but lost Martin. As Zimmerman turned to head back to his car, Martin came out of hiding and confronted Zimmerman. The rest is history.
DrJohn has been a health care professional for more than 30 years. In addition to clinical practice he has done extensive research and has published widely with over 70 original articles and abstracts in the peer-reviewed literature. DrJohn is well known in his field and has lectured on every continent except for Antarctica. He has been married to the same wonderful lady for over 30 years and has three kids- two sons, both of whom are attorneys and one daughter on her way into the field of education.
DrJohn was brought up with the concept that one can do well if one is prepared to work hard but nothing in life is guaranteed.
Except for liberals being foolish.
StrategicMC says: This can’t be possible, as the game started at 7:30 P.M. EST. The phone logs of the incident (Zimmerman calls 9-11) begin at what, approx 7:10-7:15 P.M.?
——————————–
We probably cannot find out the actual time the NBA game began due to pre-game events, like commentator cross talk, interviews, commercials, etc. The super bowl is the same way. They list one time, just to find out that the actual game doesn’t start til one hour later. Some tv and cables are more honest about the game by saying, [“Coverage] of the Superbowl will start at 4pm EST.”
@c. lindy:
Agreed. The earliest that the game would have started is 7:30 P.M. EST. Arguably, T.M. would had left in order to be back in time for the beginning of the game.
The official time line (as documented by phone logs) is consistent with this scenario.
A basketball game (NBA) is technically only 48 minutes. However, with half-time, timeouts, fouls, and close games, a basketball game is actually around 2 1/2 hours. … But, with TV, game time outs and over time the game can take from 2 to 3 hours to complete.
If the game actually began at 7:30 EST, let’s guess that half time would have been one half of the 2 1/2 hours cited to play a whole game. Divide 2 1/2 hours in half and we get 1 hour and 15 minutes to the halftime. Starting at 7:30 simply add the one hour and 15 minutes and we get a halftime of 8:45 pm.
That’s bizzare. TM leaving at halftime does not fit.
C. LINDY
ARE YOU CALCULATING THE CHANGE OF HOURS, LIKE ATLANTIC IS NOW
ONE HOUR AHEAD NOW, FROM MARCH ?????DAY
BUT THIS EVENT WAS BEFORE THE CHANGE OF TIMES,IN FEBRUARY????DAY
UNLESS FLORIDA DOES NOT HAVE THAT CHANGE OF HOUR
BYE
@ilovebeeswarzone:
Florida was still on EST in February. They move one hour ahead in spring.
AYE
HI,
DO YOU THINK THE GUN COULD HAVE EXPLODED BY THE MANIPULATION THEY BOTH MUST HAVE HAD ON IT?
BECAUSE IT WAS FULL OF BULLETS, AND LOOK PROBABLY LIKE THE ONE YOU HAD,,
IF IT WOULD HAVE EXPLOSE OR IMPLODED IT WULD HAVE KILL BOTH
I THINK
C. LINDY
YES, I was wondering if you had calculate the time from before it changed, forgetting that this happnned on FEBRUARY, IT WOULD HAVE BEEN EASY TO DO THE ERROR, MAYBE SOME OF US MIGHT HAVE DONE IT INCLUDING ME,
I just thought about it when you said it is bizare, while calculating the game on the day it happen,
bye
@Aye:
There was about 5-1/2 minutes between the start of Zimmerman’s call and the start of the altercation. Martin had at most 900 feet to travel. That’s about 2.7 feet per second, but he ran part of the way, so the rest of the time he was progressing even slower, walking around, staring, looking at houses.
@c. lindy:
I caught this @#355:
@jimrtex:
I’m sorry, but was there supposed to be some sort of proof in there that Martin chose not to return to Green’s home?
Mike O’Malley
you won the 200 comment, congratulation, I could not beat you,as much as I try,
it’s part of the game here when we get close to a hundred, or 2 or 3, I did won the 500
on one other post and the 400 and the 500 and the 600, that was the biggest POST of comments,
IT END UP PAST 755,
WE MIGHT BEAT IT RIGHT HERE, BECAUSE OF THE PREVIOUS COMMENTS, WHICH I lost track
of the count. I was watching the movie SEA BISCUIT IN THE SAME TIME, YOU MUST HAVE SEEN IT ,
IF YOU DIDN’T, YOU SHOULD, IT IS SO GOOD.
BYE
Mike O’Malley
all together we here have 368 comments, and we are still going strong,
more clues please bring them on, we will fit them in, together
with flexibility, direct from the brain,
lets go for 400?
bye
@The Strategic MC: @The Strategic MC: @The Strategic MC:
Strategic: Yes, you did make your comments @ 10:57 am and I did credit your commentary with what you said.
The time lapse of my entry was added @12:51, nearly 2 hours later. However, I had typed it much earlier and had to leave my puter, basically because it has been a busy day, considering Easter weekend and all the prep work that had to be done. When I managed to come back to my computer, my comments were still up on the screen, unsubmitted. I checked my comments and hit the submit button. Just explaining how my day went and the lapse between our commentaries.
Zowie, maybe great minds DO run in the same channel, huh? Yup, we’ll have this case solved before the investigators can turn around… ha! It would be nice if the webmaster would keep this discussion available after the fact finders have found the rock solid facts in this case too.
@Aye:
The standard explanation was that Martin was returning from the 7-11 with the skittles and ice tea for his stepbrother-to-be Chad. You have claimed that Martin was “walking down the street and sidewalk”.
Given the rate at which he was making progress, it would have taken an 1-1/2 hours to get to the 7-11 and return. Though, he probably would have walked a little faster, given that part of the way is along the shoulder of a divided road – the straightforward explanation of what he was doing was that he was bored.
In the initial local TV coverage the day after the shooting, Tracy Martin and Brandy Green are shown looking at the location of the shooting. Green said that Trayvon was bored, and then just waved her hand in the direction of her house to indicate its nearness.
Trayvon talked to his girlfriend on the phone for 6 hours that day. It is reasonable to assume that he would rather talk to her, than hang with a 13 YO.
It is consistent with the actual distance traveled that Martin was walking around looking at the houses, and just staring, whether off in space, or at the houses.
He could have easily reached home if that had been his intent. His preference (or choice) was to not do so.
BTW, there is nothing in Zimmerman’s phone call to suggest that Martin’s apparel was what caused his suspicion. The dispatcher asks “did you see what he is wearing?”, and Zimmerman describes it quite matter-of-factly.
c. lindy
hi, yes , this post and all are staying here at FA, and when you want to go back to it in later time after the traffic is gone, you can find it in the archive up on top, all the post end there for all to see,
and there is a lot and good ones
bye
@jimrtex:
Lots more keyboard clicking there but still nothing to show that “Martin chose not to return to Green’s home.”
Are you attempting to indicate that you’re clairvoyant like our very own Mr. O’Malley?
If you’re not, then there’s no way that you, or Dr. J, or anyone else, can tell us with any acuity what Martin’s thought process was. Especially in light of evidence to the contrary.
Notice how Dr. J didn’t have the courage to even attempt to answer my original query? Guess he’s quite a bit smarter than you.
@The Strategic MC:
The shooting took place on Sunday February 26th. On that day the NBA All-Star pre-game started at 7:00pm EST.
Sunday, February 26, 2012, 7:00pm EST, Amway Center
Sunset in Miami Florida on February 26th occurred at 6:21pm.
Feb 26, 2012 6:47 AM 6:21 PM 11h 33m 18s + 1m 27s 12:34 PM 55.5° 148.113
So then plaintiff”s counsel’s representation to the public that Trayvon Martin departed on a quest for skittles for the 13 year old Cory Green during NBA All-Star game half time appears to be false?
@Mike O’Malley:
Do you have any source materials that indicate that “Plaintiff’s counsel” stated that Martin’s trip was “during NBA All-Star game half time”?
If so, I would certainly love to see it.
If not, then we can safely add this to your fact-free pontificating.
@Mike O’Malley:
Mike O’Malley:
Checking the official NBA link, I think the organization misrepresented the actual NBA game-time at 7pm. If you check the next column, you will see that a Celebrity event preceded the actual game, where entertainers took the court as a form of warming up the crowd with an entertainment venue. The Celebrity slot @ 7:00 pm was part of various packages sold for the NBA game. It’s all about marketing. The time on the Celebrity event is listed at 7:00 pm by the NBA site. So, it sounds like the actual game probably followed the Celebrity event at 7:30 pm. Whether they started the actual NBA game exactly at 7:30 sharp, remains questionable. The actual NBA game is listed all over the internet at 7:30 pm, including TBN tv/cable, who covered the NBA game. TBN does not list the Celebrity event… just the NBA game at 7:30 pm.
@c. lindy:
No worries.
The genesis for this narrative (Skittles At Halftime) is either from Ben Crump or Tracy Martin.
Newspaper and blog accounts have run with Tea And Skittles before the game and Tea and Skittles at halftime.
Clearly, whatever T.M. was doing, it took place before the beginning of the game was to begin at 7:30 P.M..
Regardless of the actual source, the intention of the narrative has been to provide the most benign and emotionally laden explanation (“candy for his little brother”) for the activities of Trayvon Martin just prior to the fatal confrontation.
Tracy Martin and Ben Crump cannot keep their stories straight:
SANFORD, Fla. (WOFL FOX 35) -On Monday afternoon, a FOX 35 News crew met with Tracy Martin who said the victim in the shooting is her [his] 17-year-old son, Trayvon, who was visiting from Miami.
“He walked out of the house to go to the store. He was going to the store,” she [he] said. “He doesn’t know anybody here. He just came down here, so he was bored, so he walked down to the store. He was on his way back home. I’m living down here. He was sitting on the porch and this man killed him.”
(Monday 27 Feb 2012 – Updated: Friday 23 Mar 2012)
(People Magazine ) –”I had gone out for dinner,” says Tracy, “and when I got home, Trayvon wasn’t there. I tried calling his cell phone several times, and it went straight to voicemail. I wasn’t that worried, because he had been spending time with my 20-year-old nephew who was a responsible young man. There wasn’t a panic that he wasn’t at home. I figured that they had gone to the movies, because they had said they might. So I laid down, thinking they would show up later.”
(Saturday March 24 2012)
And no, I am not defending George Zimmerman or calling Trayvon’s father a liar, but Tracy Martin’s conflicting accounts are strange indeed.
Update: Another account that tells a somewhat different story:
(HuffPo ) –”He had a gun, and Trayvon had Skittles,” Benjamin Crump, a family attorney, told The Huffington Post this afternoon.
Martin, 17, a high school junior who lived with his mother in Miami, was visiting his father and stepmother at their home in Sanford, a suburb of Orlando, on the weekend of Feb. 26.
During halftime of the NBA All-Star Game, Martin’s family said he walked to a nearby convenience store to get some candy for his younger brother. On his way back home, according to reports, he caught the attention of George Zimmerman, a self-appointed captain of The Retreat at Twin Lakes neighborhood watch.
(Thursday March 8 2012 Updated: Tuesday March 20 2012)
I know, it’s a hard thing to do when you’re trying to “work” the media. Disinformation campaigns are pretty complicated, with all the moving parts and $$$ at stake.
I think that’s why they brought in Al Sharpton; he’s a master at these things.
OBTW, I found these stories with less than 2 minutes on Google.
(HuffPo ) –”He had a gun, and Trayvon had Skittles,” Benjamin Crump, a family attorney, told The Huffington Post this afternoon.
Martin, 17, a high school junior who lived with his mother in Miami, was visiting his father and stepmother at their home in Sanford, a suburb of Orlando, on the weekend of Feb. 26.
During halftime of the NBA All-Star Game, Martin’s family said he walked to a nearby convenience store to get some candy for his younger brother. On his way back home, according to reports, he caught the attention of George Zimmerman, a self-appointed captain of The Retreat at Twin Lakes neighborhood watch.
(Thursday March 8 2012 Updated: Tuesday March 20 2012)
@Aye:
You apparently are reading a lot into the word “choice”.
If you have some peanut butter and jelly, some bologna and cheese, and bread, and make a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. You have chosen not to make the bologna and cheese. This assumes that you have the physical capacity to make either, and are not being compelled by someone (your mother for example) to make the PBJ.
Just because I note that you chose not to make the bologna and cheese, does not imply that I think you made a wise or unwise nutritional choice, or think you are underweight.
Similarly, when Zimmerman is asked by the dispatcher what race the individual is, and he replies that he is black, it just means that he is black, not that Zimmerman chose to observe him because he was black. If you listen to Zimmerman’s tone, it indicates that initially he thought Martin was black; and then when he got closer he was more certain. He was asked what clothing Martin was wearing. He gave an apparently accurate description, though it has never been reported that Martin actually had white sneakers or not. When he told the dispatcher that he wanted the police officer to call him so that he could tell him where he was at, there is no reason to assume that it means anything other than literally that. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
I assume that Martin had the physical capacity to make it back to where he was staying. I assume that he had the mental capacity, had not suffered a stroke, was not drug impaired or intoxicated, had not forgotten where he was staying, and did not have amnesia. He made a choice.
What do you mean by the word “choice” or “choose”?
There is quite solid evidence to support a conclusion that Martin could have made it from where Zimmerman first saw him to where he was staying in the time from when Zimmerman called until the time of the altercation. It is speculative that Martin preferred to talk on the phone with his girlfriend rather than be where he was staying, or even that he was talking to her.
There is absolutely no evidence that Martin was “walking down the sidewalk” with its connotation that he was going directly to where he was staying.
The Strategic MC
HE HAD A GUN AND MARTIN HAD SKITTLES,
AND HIS FISTS AND HIS WILL TO KILL IN A CONFRONTATION,
ZIMMERMAN HAD ONLY A GUN, HE ONLY USE IT AFTER BEING BEATEN, NOSE BROKEN AND BEING TOLD HE WAS GOING TO GET KILL BY THE ONE WITHOUT A GUN, BUT
A STRENGTH AND A WISH TO KILL,
SOME THING TO REFLEX UPON,
THE 6 BOYS WHO ATTACK AN OLDER MAN UNARMED, ONE HAD HAMMER AND HIT HIM ON THE HEAD
REPEATEDLY, WHILE THE MAN PLEAD TO STOP
THE OTHER HAD FOOT KICK THE OTHER WAS HOLDING THE WOUNDED MAN UPPER BODY UPWARD SO THEY COULD KICK HIM ON AND ON, THEY CARRY HIM IN THE WOODS TO BE LEFT UNSEEN TO DIE, THEY HAD THE WISH TO KILL ALL 6 OF THEM BLACKS , COULD HAVE BEEN THE OTHER SIX SONS OF OBAMA
THAT IS BESIDE THE 13 YEAR OLD WHITE BOY HAVING GASOLINE THROWN ON HIS UPPER BODY,
WHILE THE OTHER FLICK THE BICK, IN FRONT OF HIS HOUSE, LEAVING DISFIGURED MARKS FOR LIFE ON HIS FACE, AND IN HIS BRAIN. ECETERA ECETERA
OBAMA YOUR COULD HAVE BEEN SONS ARE VIOLENT AND HATE THE WHITES.
CHECK IT UP, AND STOP USING THE HATE CARD, SEE WHAT HAS HAPPENED BECAUSE OF IT ??????
jimrtex
hi, we don’t yet know if he had ingest or sniff or aspire the drug with the pipe he was carrying,.
we will hopefully learn at one time, after the one who is working on his test,
that is very important, if he was or not, because the drug change the person judgement,
it increase the combative behaviors on one if feel threaten also.
that could tell us a lot on the why’s
bye
Ilovebeezone said” HE HAD A GUN AND MARTIN HAD SKITTLES,
AND HIS FISTS AND HIS WILL TO KILL IN A CONFRONTATION…
————————–
I don’t know about you, but if I’m ever in a confrontation and have the choice of which defense would be best, I would choose a gun everytime. I’d be pretty stupid to think Skittles, my fists (and my will to stay alive) would see me through a nasty confrontation.
Ilovebeezone said in reference to an episode involving a killing by 6 blacks: COULD HAVE BEEN THE OTHER SIX SONS OF OBAMA.
—————
Your unrelated remark, intended for the President of the United States injected into your post about a killing incident is uncalled for. In fact, it is a blatant racial slur.
c’ lindy
I should have added, HE didn’t know about the gun, he had his fist and wish to kill,
meaning ZIMMERMAN HAD THE GUN, BUT NO WISH TO KILL.
ABOUT OBAMA, COULD BE SONS, HE SAID IT HIMSELF, I repeated his words,
yes racist is in it?
@The Strategic MC:
There is video of this:
Teen shot and killed in neighborhood altercation
The text actually ran the quotes from Tracy Martin and Brandy Green together, and apparently they got confused when editing, and thought Tracy was a female name, and didn’t understand the relationship between Tracy Martin and Green. In the video she is identified as someone “Knew Teen Who Was Shot”.
If you watch the video, she is pointing with her hand towards where she lives. “I’m living down here” to indicate the short distance to her house. I interpret “He was sitting on the porch” to mean that when she and Tracy Martin left for dinner, Trayvon was sitting out on her patio, not that he was sitting on a patio when he was shot.
It has been reported that when Tracy Martin reported his son missing (on the next day, which was when the video was shot), that the police asked for a description, and then were told that they needed to talk in person. 3 cars showed up, including two unmarked cars, including one with a chaplain. It is quite unlikely that the police would have told them that Trayvon was sitting on a porch and someone shot him.
They would have told them where had happened, and that they had a suspect in custody. They likely would have asked if they knew what Martin was doing. Maybe Trayvon had told Chad where he was going. It doesn’t sound like they were manufacturing a cover story, or had been in contact with Ben Crump. So “on the porch” probably refers to her porch.
The press has a hard time either figuring out relationships or reporting them. Trayvon Martin has an older (half?) brother who has the same last name as his mother. Tracy Martin and Sabryna Fulton reportedly “divorced” when Trayvon was 4. It would not surprise me if Tracy Martin had other relationships with women over the following 13 years. But it is easier to refer to Green as “fiance” or “stepmother” or “stepmother to be” and Chad as friend. And now that the presentation of Tracy Martin and Sabryna Fulton is of separated-but-still-amicable, Green has been demoted to family friend.
BTW, I’m pretty sure that John in the video, is one of the 911 callers (the only male, other than the teenager who gets handed the phone). He has some unusual speech patterns (eg on the 911 call, he says “I am thinking that other people are calling…”, In the TV interview, the interviewer asks “and what are you thinking now?”, perhaps as if they were echoing the language of the interviewee to get them to continue speaking.
@ilovebeeswarzone:
First: You have no idea of Zimmerman’s intentions.
Second: You are twisting your retort to fit your defense of a racial slur.
It wasn’t entirely on his own initiative, but a question he was asked about Trayvon Martin left him no choice. When he finally spoke, he began haltingly.
He said, “The death of 17-year-old Martin at the hands of George Zimmerman in a Florida suburb was a tragedy. He said he sympathized with the parents, and that various law enforcement agencies should diligently investigate the matter. “If I had a son,” Obama said, “he’d look like Trayvon,” is what the President said and is what you are twisting into a racial comment. Nice try.
Obama acknowledged not only that he is black, but that even the president isn’t immune to stereotypes that sometimes can turn deadly.
For Obama to embrace Trayvon Martin – linking him with his own children and calling him “this boy” with fatherly concern – gives the (racially anxious) one more reason to take shots at the President, simply because he is bi-racial … half black… half white. It appears your explanation doesn’t hold water.
c’ lindy
you say it wasn’t entirely on his own initiative, but because he was ask a question,
okay
it wasn’t entirely of my own initiative, but he said TRAYVON could have been his son,
and I said they could have been his sons, all of them, because he said one could, why not the other?
you have the twisted mind to interpreted it your own way,
not me, I’m not a racist, I am outrage by the crimes comited on the name of TRAYVON,
AS TO AVENGE HIS DEATH WHICH IS HIS OWN DOING, FROM HIS FIRST WISH TO KILL ZIMMERMAN,
ALWAYS BE CAREFULL WHAT YOU WISH FOR.
C. LINDY
YOU ARE STEPPING AWAY FROM THE COURTEOUS LINE , YOU RECEIVED FROM ME,
AND YOU HAVE EXPOSE YOUR THOUGHTS WHICH I DON’T SHARE.
AND I have no wish to communicate with you on this POST,BECAUSE I DON’T LIKE
YOU ATTACKING ME, ON THIS, JUST BECAUSE YOU DID NOT UNDERSTAND THE MEANING
OF THE WORDS.
I’ll just say one thing in general to all general readers. The last person in the world who claims he/she is not racist, is indeed a racist. And when someone calls them out on it, they pick up their football everyone is playing with and they go home in a huff.
c. lindy
I am still here, discovering your intent, hey dude, you lost your credibility,
it took a while, but you couldn’t hold any further,
talk to yourself, we know what you are, we have those critters here at times,
they crawL in and out,
like ELVIS SANG;
YOU TOLD YOUR LINE SO CLEVERLY, BUT IT DID COLLAPSE NOW,
@jimrtex:
Great catch on this; I didn’t know that quotes had been mangled.
I would argue that “the press has had a hard time” because the narrative keeps running into things, in addition to having trouble with the basic WWWWH stuff.
@The Strategic MC:
Or, it could be that the “narrative”, as you call it, is very simply the truth.
@The Strategic MC:
Dayum Dood… You keep trying and failing when you attempt to play researcher for Mr. O’Malley.
This is what I asked him:
Your response doesn’t come anywhere close to answering the question. Not even close.
I’m beginning to think that you and Mr. O’Malley like to shake your keyboards just to see what will fall out.
Too bad you’re in a place now that will challenge you on your claims.
@jimrtex:
Dood… You’re just embarrassing yourself now man.
The question I posed to Dr. J was clear and unequivocal. Here it is again for your convenience:
So far, you’ve replied in Dr. J’s stead three times I think and you’ve yet to answer the question. Why is it so difficult? Surely Dr. J wouldn’t type something that is not supported by fact. Would he?
Don’t get distracted with analogies about bologna or talking about Zimmerman and the 911 call or anything other sort of nonsensical bull.
Simply attempt to resolve the conundrum that Dr. J created.
Focus man. Focus.
@Aye:
We seem to have different styles of communication. Yours appears to be more emotional, and like you were talking to someone, and where you use “dood” you may think you are actually conveying meaning.
Your question is not clear or unequivocal.
There were about 5-1/2 minutes between when Zimmerman called and when Martin was shot. Do you want me to document this? There were a maximum of 800 feet between where Martin was when Zimmerman called, and Green’s home. Do you want me to document that?
Or are you not willing to try to comprehend my explanation, and demand a link on NBC’s web site?
@jimrtex:
Sigh… I think you’re just trying to be obtuse now. Do I need to get out a box of crayons in order to help you along?
It’s really quite simple. Dr J claimed:
Now, where is the proof that MARTIN…CHOSE NOT TO DO THAT [RETURN TO GREEN’S HOME]?
Surely there is some piece of evidence to support Dr. J’s claim. Otherwise he’s… well, he’s lying… because he’s making claims he cannot support with fact.
You’d have been better of to have let Dr. J, as well as our resident clairvoyant Mr. O’Malley, attempt to pitch themselves out of their own sand traps. By embroiling yourself, and then being so desperately unsuccessful in your attempts to help, you’re simply making yourself look foolish.
Now, if you can prove that MARTIN…CHOSE NOT TO DO THAT [RETURN TO GREEN’S HOME] then do so.
Otherwise, go sit down.
@Aye:
Does this meet your standards of “anywhere close”?
ORLANDO, Florida (Reuters) – The family of a 17-year-old African-American boy shot to death last month in his gated Florida community by a white Neighborhood Watch captain wants to see the captain arrested, the family’s lawyer said on Wednesday.
Trayvon Martin was shot dead after he took a break from watching NBA All-Star game television coverage to walk 10 minutes to a convenience store to buy snacks including Skittles candy requested by his 13-year-old brother, Chad, the family’s lawyer (“Plaintiff’s counsel”) Ben Crump said.
My initial response contained similar info. The interview by Huffington Post was with Ben Crump.
The relevant segment containing “During halftime of the NBA All-Star Game, … he walked to a nearby convenience store to get some candy for his younger brother” is attributed to “the Martin Family” without actually quoting them. Unreasonable to believe that this information was provided to HuffPo by Crump, the Martin family attorney?
I answered the question directed to Mr. O’Malley as I had made mention of the role being played by Ben Crump in earlier post and believed that I had a credible answer. Still do, btw.
I discuss and offer info in good faith and am prepared to offer substantiation for all that I claim has a factual basis. Challenge away.
@Aye:
Time will tell, won’t it?
@The Strategic MC:
I placed the ball back on the tee for you and you still whiffed it.
There’s not one damned thing in your cited material where “Plaintiff’s counsel” says Martin left during ““during NBA All-Star game half time”” as was originally claimed.
Darn it.
Care to try again?
@The Strategic MC:
Thanks TSMC.
We can reiterate:
Not unreasonable TSMC. As the interview was of Ben Crump, legal counsel and media spokesman for the Martin Family, only an unreasonable chap would seem willing to even raise such an objection in the first place. Why would a reasonable fellow waste anyone’s time with such an objection.
@Mike O’Malley:
The reason is simple Mr. O’Malley. In your short time here you’ve demonstrated your propensity to lie in what is, apparently, an effortless fashion.
Sir, you’re claiming that a person made statements yet you cannot support those claims with any sort of source material whatsoever.
Wouldn’t you agree that you owe the readers here an effort to remain within the confines of the truth?
Wouldn’t you agree that the readers here deserve to see you called out for your falsehoods?
Every outright lie, every half truth, every effort to twist the truth into something that it’s not is an insult to the readers here.
@Aye:
Do you require direct quotes IOT acknowledge the point? How about context, or is that too subjective of a criterion?
Do either Ben Crump or Natalie Jackson need to be identified specifically as “Plaintiff’s counsel” or will “Martin family attorney” do?
What are the ground-rules here?
@The Strategic MC:
One would like to think that such contradictory statements would be a red flag for all reasonable observers.
Lets review:
Prior to the incident Trayvon Martin earned three suspensions from his local school. There is evidence that Trayvon Martin;
Engaged in trespass,
Was involved in burglary,
Used drugs,
Sold drugs on school premises and not unlikely sold drugs to minors’
and violently assaulted a bus driver.
Only the last item, the violent assault on a bus driver might likely have been unknown to Tracy Martin. And yet Tracy Martin the father told People magazine, “and when I got home, Trayvon wasn’t there. I tried calling his cell phone several times, and it went straight to voicemail. I wasn’t that worried, because he had been spending time with my 20-year-old nephew who was a responsible young man. There wasn’t a panic that he wasn’t at home. I figured that they had gone to the movies, because they had said they might. So I laid down, thinking they would show up later.”
Good lord, how could Tracy Martin possibly not entertain a concern that his son might just might perhaps be up to no good?
given:
That we should expect that Tracy Martin would have learned directly or indirectly from the Miami school that there is evidence that Trayvon Martin;
Engaged in trespass,
Was involved in burglary,
Used drugs,
Sold drugs on school premises and not unlikely sold drugs to minors?
@Mike O’Malley:
And yet another string of lies spews forth from Mr. O’Malley:
Surely you can provide source material to support these claims right?
Right?
@The Strategic MC:
The ground rules, the standards, were clearly established by Mr. O’Malley’s claim.
Solve his conundrum, if you can, based on those parameters.