Skye Speaks on Assault by Peacenik

Stellar interview and post, Mike.

skye is the absolute best!

What can I say that hasn’t been said in my previous threads?

I’ll read the post later (I only skimmed the comments, at your prodding).

Ummmm…. so you guys are criticizing people who act violently towards groups (meaning all of you)

No. We’re criticizing those peace fascists who behave as anything other than “peaceful” and tolerant of diverging points of view.

who openly advocate war which by definitiion means death and destruction on a massive scale,

We’re advocating for peace through victory. Tell us how America and Iraq would be better off by abandoning a fledgling democracy to chaos and al-Qaeda?

Do you think the suffering will be greater of lesser if we leave, prematurely?

particularly when you preemptively attack a country….. okay that makes sense.

I’d say 12 years was long enough. Saddam was a cancer upon the world. How much longer would you allow him to metastasize before offering up treatment? Better sooner or later? Was he a danger or not? Did we have justification or not?

Did any of you watch the numerous testimonies from the Winter Soldier Two?

Should I have?

Have you listened to the numerous soldiers who don’t agree with them, or you?

In particular did anyone listen to Jon Turner’s testimony and watch the video and look at the pictures? Do you think only “good” comes from war? Are Iraqi civilians even important to any of you or jut US soldiers?

Just curious

Do YOU think any good comes out of war?

Do you think our soldiers are terrorizing innocent Iraqis and children?

Do you not care about the children AND the soldiers?

Just curious.

Yes, I’ve seen horrible pictures, including a medicolegal forensic text showing graphic images of victims of blunt-force head trauma, gunshot wounds to the face and body, the results of edged weapons attack, etc.

Violence is horrible. But how do you stop violence against innocents? Hating violence and war is not the same thing as advocating for peace. Are we targeting innocent Iraqis, or are the insurgents, foreign fighters, and al-Qaeda terrorists the ones targeting them?

Oh….look….here are pictures of our soldiers terrorizing the Iraqi people:

Uh oh, that kid looks like he’s toast:

A schoolboy waves at a U.S. army soldier who is on a foot patrol in Baghdad’s Dora neighborhood. Hadi Mizban – AP

Any moment now, this soldier is going to open fire:

At least these kids are smart enough to run away:

Good heavens…this soldier is attempting to crush the girl to death in a lethal bear hug:

Uh oh….this kid is running away from the terrorist American soldier:

See? Best place to hide is behind the American soldier, where the soldier can’t see him.

Oh, how these kids hate our soldiers! They are taking revenge. Look:

These kids must be trying to rob the poor soldier of his wallet:

February 12, 2008: U.S. Army Staff Sgt. William Lambert, 30, of Plainview, Ark, shows photographs of his children to Iraqi children in Beijia, south of Baghdad. By Maya Alleruzzo, AP

These kids must be asking him to surrender his weapon:

Children greet a U.S. soldier of Alpha Troop, 3-89 CAV while on patrol in central Baghdad’s Fadhil district, April 16, 2008.
REUTERS/Erik De Castro

According to Michael Yon:

The U.S. military is the most respected institution in Iraq, and many Iraqi boys dream of becoming American soldiers. Yes, young Iraqi boys know about “GoArmy.com.”

Hating war is not the same thing as wanting peace. If you are opposed to suffering, war, and violence, you should support our efforts in Iraq:

A U.S. Army Soldier from Charlie Company, 4th Battalion, 9th Infantry Regiment, 4th Stryker Brigade Combat Team, 2nd Infantry Division, from Ft. Lewis, Wash., shares a laughs with an Iraqi army soldier at a U.S. and Iraqi Army security checkpoint in Tarmiyah, Iraq, Sept. 25, 2007. U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication 2nd Class Summer M. Anderson.

U.S. Army Sgt. Quenton Sallows hands out Iraqi Flags to Iraqi children beginning their first day of school in Lutafiyah, Iraq, Oct. 1, 2007. Sallows is assigned to Civil Affairs, 2nd Battalion, 15th Field Artillery Regiment, 2nd Brigade Combat Team, 10th Mountain Division (Light Infantry). U.S. Air Force photo by Staff Sgt. Quinton Russ.

Nice to Meet You

U.S. Marine Corps Cpl. Julia Venegas, from 2nd Marine Logistics Group, shakes hands with a little girl in the village of Kabani, Iraq, while on a security patrol Sept. 28, 2007. U.S. Marine Corps photo taken by Lance Cpl. Robert S. Morgan.

A U.S. Army Soldier of 1st Battalion, 38th Infantry Regiment, 4th Brigade Combat Team, 2nd Infantry Division plays with a young Iraqi boy in Mufriq, Iraq, Oct. 8, 2007. U.S. Air Force photo by Staff Sgt. Shawn Weismiller.

Iraqi girls walk to a primary school in the Andaloos district of Fallujah, Iraq, Oct. 17, 2007, to receive school supplies from U.S. Marines and Iraqi police. U.S. Marine Corps photo by Sgt. Robert B. Brown Jr.

The students at an elementary school in Jerf Al-Mila hold up their ‘Junior Hero’ stickers after taking an oath to become honorary Junior Heroes during a visit to the school by Iraqi Army Soldiers from the 3rd Battalion, 2nd Brigade, 9th Iraqi Army Division (mechanized), Oct. 17. The Junior Hero program was designed by the Iraqi security forces to teach children about the roles of the Iraqi Army and Iraqi police who work in their communities and ways in which they can volunteer to keep their villages free of crime. Photo by Staff Sgt. Jon Cupp, 1st Brigade Combat Team, 1st Cavalry Division Public Affairs

A Sucker for Children

U.S. Marine Corps Lance Cpl. Patrick K. Mason, a squad leader for 1st Platoon, Alpha Company, 1st Battalion, 7th Marine Regiment, hands a lollipop to an Iraqi boy during a security patrol in Dulab, Iraq, Sept. 25, 2007. The Marines are working with Iraqi police in support of Operation Iraqi Freedom in the Al Anbar province of Iraq. U.S. Marine Corps photo by Cpl. Shane S. Keller.

To be opposed to our presence and efforts in Iraq is to be standing in the way of history’s momentum; and on the wrong side of it.

Link me up. I get visited on occasion by an anti-war blue star mom. We get along, even as we disagree. I’ve heard enough testimony from anti-war vets; I even have some anti-war milbloggers on my sidebar. Their perspective is important, but doesn’t mean it’s the only perspective, let alone the “correct one”.

Now show the pictures of the brutality of war “wordsmith”. Show the dead bodies of Iraqis. Show the coffins of the returning US soldiers…oh wait you can’t because the a virtual black out by the media.

Oh, I have seen them, Brandon. Some of the most grisly things that can be done to a human body. (and if you want to see the flag-draped coffins, just watch my Memorial Day videos)

But you still miss the point. Will those images cease, simply because we leave Iraq?

The absence of war is not the same thing as having peace.

You’re obviously on auto-pilot and just spouting your preconceived beliefs without engaging exactly what I wrote in my comments.

Michael Ware, btw, said if we vacate Iraq prematurely, it’d be a bloodbath.

I’m tired of guys like you ovestating Al Queda.

Who’s overstating their influence? You’re not understating it, are you?

It’s not necessarily a matter of numbers, but leadership in fomenting the chaos.

I have two friends, one of which served two tours in Iraq and the other in Iraq and Afghanistan . they both have differing opinions from yours but then again they’ve actually been there.

Yes, and I know vets of both theaters as well; and NONE of them share your defeatist ideology.

Nice, skye.

Defeatist ideology? Go back and read my original post.

Ok.

Brandon’s original comment in its entirety:

Ummmm…. so you guys are criticizing people who act violently towards groups (meaning all of you) who openly advocate war which by definitiion means death and destruction on a massive scale, particularly when you preemptively attack a country….. okay that makes sense.

Did any of you watch the numerous testimonies from the Winter Soldier Two? In particular did anyone listen to Jon Turner’s testimony and watch the video and look at the pictures? Do you think only “good” comes from war? Are Iraqi civilians even important to any of you or jut US soldiers?

Just curious.

Ok, read it a second time, and the first paragraph is just offensive as the first time I read it.

Finished? Good. Now where did I mention defeatism or withdrawal. Oh, I didn’t. You put words in my mouth. Is that your thing? You make stuff up?

Lol…you go back and read what else you wrote, subsequent to your original post. What do you call it, when you’re rah-rahing Winter Soldiers and Jon Turner and testimony on atrocities committed by our soldiers; when you talk about flag-draped coffins and the bodies of innocent Iraqis. Are you saying we should prosecute this war more aggressively, and really go after the ones committing these acts of violence against the innocent Iraqis? No. You’re saying our soldiers are the ones committing these atrocities. Yes you are.

You want us to abandon innocent Iraqis to chaos and more suffering that would occur if we left prematurely. You basically piss away the sacrifice of all those who bled and died to achieve success. If I have your number pegged wrong, then correct me. Quit crying like an indignant bitch because you had your feelings hurt. Grow some thicker skin and quit playing the role of persecuted victim. You set the tone of the debate as much as I did. But typical, like Karen Porter, you see me as the aggressor and you the civil, rational, tolerant one.

Putting words in your mouth? Please. You did just as much. Go back and read your comments. Check out comment #20:

Please all of you watch the testimonies of Jon Turner and others. Then we can have a conversation. My friends who served didn’t have a “defeatist attitude” as you put it. They just acknowledged that there are things over there that are beyond the control of our military.

Sounds like you’re projecting my labeling “defeatism” from you, onto them.

You disrespectfully reject Michael Yon (who’s probably spent more time as an embed than any other reporter over there), not because what he says isn’t valuable, but because it doesn’t fit what you wish to believe. I, however, listen to Lara Logan and pay attention to what Michael Ware has to say. Do you bother to read Bill Roggio or Michael Totten? I don’t dismiss the “facts” as reported by Lara Logan and Michael Ware. They do important work. But what I reject is the liberal anti-war perspective filter those facts are sifted through. You can have two people see the same set of events, and their lens filter will shape it to how they understood and processed what the information entails. One might see the glass half empty. The other will see it half full. Which one is right?

Brandon #21:

One of the central problems with the Gov. of Iraq is corruption. My friend who served worked in Civilian Affairs. He deals with the various local Governments. He says that the idea of a central Gov. is unlikely considering that each group: Sunnis, Shias and Kurds do not want the other to have too much power. How do you solve that through Military?

Best comment you’ve left so far. Free of snide barbs and whiny complaints of persecution (“conservatives are so mean! They called me out on my BS”).

Yes, I’m being mean and uncivil. I admit it. You let me push your buttons. Apparently, you didn’t like my humorous sarcasm in my first comment to you. Put you in a sour-puss mood.

Now, back to your comment: Corruption is definitely a problem. And no, the military can’t solve their political problems, for them. But things definitely can’t move ahead without the security of a safe environment. Many Iraqis have lost their lives, trying to make things work with the new government. Insurgents- Baathists and Saddam loyalists, thugs, foreign fighters and al-Qaeda operatives have worked to wreck havoc and foment dissent to sabotage efforts of Iraq reconstruction and reconciliation.

Brandon #22:

Preconceived beliefs huh? Actually I’m one of those rare creatures (unlike you) who changes his mind when presented with differing views.

Like I said, “preconceived beliefs”, like the one you have about me not being able to shift views.

I actually supported the invasion of Iraq but heh don’t let little things like facts get in the way of your argument.

It is you who is on auto pilot.

In part, yes. Because what you typed out, for the most part, reads like the countless inane, pompous, moonbat comments we read on a daily basis. How am I to treat you as someone special, if you haven’t proved you’re different? You come in here, talking like you’re presenting some novel ideas, here. Been there, read that. Yet I’m still willing to indulge you.

Since you’re so good at twisting people’s words, would you rather just argue with yourself?

No, not really. It’d be too much intellectual stimulation for my brain to handle. I’d probably lose that argument by winning, anyway.

You have yet to get anything right about my opinions, but it’s fun watching you make stuff up. Next you’ll probably say I’m a Muslim or wait maybe I supported Saddam……fill in next insult………

You just keep delivering prepared rebuttals. If you want to know what I think perhaps you should ask because your assumptions about me are wrong. And you know what they say about people who assume……..

Didn’t I ask you a series of questions early on, to get a sense of who you are? What happened? Sidestepped the questions? Conveniently ignored them? Moved the goal posts? Go back and reread my brilliant comment #7. My guess is, you skimmed past, because you weren’t interested in possibly engaging my points or learning anything new; just in rebutting and being hissy.

Ok, so tell me about yourself and what you’re about, so I don’t “assume”.

Are you a Paul Bearer (supporter of Ron Paul, like Adam Kokesh)?

Comment #23:

I mentioned the Iraqi civilians BECAUSE I feel that our Media ignores them.

Gee…when you brought up Lara Logan, I assumed you’ve watched her pieces. I guess I did make an ass out of u and me.

Do you read the NYTimes? Washington Post? 60 Minutes? MAINSTREAM NEWS?!!! In what manner are they “ignoring” Iraqi civilians?

The 2 million displced Iraqis, the thousnds of dead men women and children.

Much of which, I already know about because of the mainstream news; and what doesn’t go deep enough in coverage, I sometimes can acquire through alternate media.

But do you balance out the negatives with the positive stories? Or do you only gravitate toward the negative, the way you accuse us of leaning toward positive news stories?

Why is it so wrong to bring this up? How does that make me a defeatist?

You’re right: Bringing it up in and of itself doesn’t make you a defeatist. But in the context of how you brought it up, my assumptions about you, I’d say, were logical ones to make. If I’m wrong, prove me wrong. I’d be more than happy to apologize.

Comment #24

It’s been fun being insulted and having my words twisted by you Wordsmith.

It worked both ways, didn’t it? The suggestion in your remarks is that we must not care about Iraqi children and flag-draped coffins. And that we criticize protesters for getting violent toward those who are pro-victory (or warmongerers, as you seem to like to characterize them).

So, going back to your original comment, do you condemn the violent action of John Meicht toward skye? Or condone it? Do you not see the sad humor and irony in “peace activists” using violence to get across their message of peace?

I’m sure if we met in person youd probably assault me or something equally scary.

Oh, yes. I’m the conservative boogeyman.

Boo!

I’ve got to run. Maybe tommorrow I’ll let you insult me some more. I’m kind of on this “turn the other cheek” deal right now. Prayer has a powe4rful effect.

I really…..really……really am happy I was not drinking hot morning coffee as I read that.

You have a strange perception of your own self-worth as the persecuted saint of civility. Go back and read some of the tone and tenor of your comments.