The age of global pseudonymous scientific publication has begun.
This is a well-sourced article making the case for laboratory escape & contrasting to zoonosis. Has explicit epistemology. Avoids obvious tinfoil hat gotchas. Provides links. Worth reading.https://t.co/kR3tLLC22K pic.twitter.com/NJ4sCRWfP7
— Balaji S. Srinivasan (@balajis) April 16, 2020
@kitt:
A few years back, my AMERICAN made Ford Aerostar had an argument with a dear up on the Eastern Shore of Virginia, necessitating a new purchase. The Aerostar was discontinued, so I bought a “Ford Transit Connect” that turned out to be made in Spain… Is a piece of shite. The brakes constantly rust, and the wiring is made out of rat or mouse or squirrel food. I’m ready to drive it into the ocean to drown the little buggers…
@George Wells: No argument the dumb thing decided to try to race us and didnt keep its lane. Just grill and driver headlights. Deer not Dear, no where near any deer crossing signs, what was it thinking! I would guess 125 to 150 Lbs dressed out it was a big one.
Sticker shock is making sweetie hesitate.
@Deplorable Me, #95:
Trump and his servile lackeys aren’t acting as if it might have come out of the Wuhan lab. They’re asserting that there’s “enormous evidence” that it did. They’re attempting to shift all blame for the pandemic to China, while simultaneously setting the stage to shift blame for the surge in deaths that could result from their next stupid move onto the individual states and their governors. It’s all about political maneuvering. They throw out statements just to see what the response will be. Trump pushes for the economy to reopen, then criticizes governors for doing so too early; yesterday the administration’s COVID-19 task force was going to be disbanded, but today, it’s going to continue indefinitely. He creates a fog of contradiction and confusion. What’s true today may not be true tomorrow, but we’re supposed to accept without question whatever he’s saying at the moment, and any reporter who balks immediately comes under attack.
There was more than enough evidence to remove Trump from office, even without testimony from the 12 material witnesses that he personally blocked and all of the Executive Branch documents and evidence that he personally locked down. He’s still in the White House only because of that blatant obstruction, and because of the rigging of the Senate impeachment trial by his Senate toady, Mitch McConnell.
@kitt:
I understand you tried to correct He Who Is Perfect, but to no avail because He Who Is Perfect came back with:
I was not referring to “bastid.”
I was referring to:
your a coward
The correct spelling would have been
“you’re a coward,” an abbreviation of “you are a coward.”
Retire0Shite-for-Brains may be forgiven, as English obviously isn’t her first language, or else the chemo for her glioblastoma isn’t working.
I’m surprised at you, Kitt. You failed to give proper deference to He Who Is Perfect, not being properly appreciative that he is here to make sure that no one makes what rational people would consider a simple typo. I am also surprised that you did not thank him for honoring all us lesser people with his presence here at FA.
See, you can have absolutely no viable excuse for not bowing before He Who Is Perfect. Nor agreeing with him about my being “locked down” in some “facility.” Obviously, He Who Is Perfect doesn’t seem to understand that ranch work goes on, Kung Flu or no Kung Flu. New barn to be finished, hay fields to be sprigged, new calves to be protected against coyotes who are licking their chops (dead coyotes slung across the fence makes a wonderful decoration). Of course, he added “WiFi” to his comment about pulling the plug. Remember, he was dismayed to learn I was still breathing in another post. Me thinks Mr. Perfect would be really happy to learn I was no longer among the living.
So color me really surprised at you, Kitt. You have failed in your commanded adoration of our new typing hall monitor.
BTW, try finding a 7.6 Ford diesel if you want reliability or the newer one that wins against a road cow every time.
@George Wells: First, to my knowledge, @kitt: is not running the official investigation we are discussing (correct me if I am wrong, @kitt: ). There are plenty of theories about how this was created and unleashed, and some or all of that could be true; let’s conduct an investigation and find out. What is amazing is how the left is so afraid of a thorough investigation to determine the facts of how it developed and spread. It is more than apparent the primary interest Democrats have is blaming the whole thing on Trump.
@Greg:
They are citing evidence. I stated long ago that it was odd that while China declared this virus originated in the wet market from the sale of bats that they have not banned the sale of bats at that very wet market. But, maybe the authorities in China don’t have the power to enforce such bans?
EVERY death is the responsibility of China and the WHO. China suppressed information and knowledge of the virus for months as it spread, not just in China but around the world. Knowing it was transmissible between humans, they lied about it. They stopped travel out of Wuhan into China, but not out of Wuhan overseas. Trump doesn’t need to shift anything; he has acted with determination and leadership and prevented an already bad situation from becoming far, far worse. Plus, he did while Democrats in Congress not only never did a goddamn thing to assist the mitigation of the crisis, but they obstructed aid and efforts wherever and whenever they could. How many died because Democrats spread fear and panic and denied the effectiveness of drugs and treatments? It’s funny; I’m neither foggy or contradicted about what Trump has done, but then again, I don’t make up an alternate reality to fit into a scenario of hate.
No, not a single solitary shred of anything. Otherwise, he would have been charged with something or removed. Effort after phony effort failed because they were based entirely on lies. The Democrat party is fueled by lies.
@Deplorable Me:
That is an interesting assertion.
First, if the virus’ penetration into the human genome was a natural occurrence, the fact that China and/or the WHO made erroneous statements about it early on doesn’t make them directly culpable for resulting deaths, particularly in the light of our own often incorrect statements to the same effect.
Second, if the virus WAS accidentally released by a Chinese lab and it subsequently penetrated the human genome, it would be incredibly difficult to make a legal case against the Chinese for manslaughter, as the virus’ first victims were Chinese.
Third, since the Chinese made what they hoped were sufficient efforts to either stop or contain the virus’ spread, only to find their own efforts failing, I’m not sure that an “official” warning from the Chinese would have been significantly more valuable than the anecdotal warnings we were already getting from Chinese individuals. We already knew how little we could trust “Chinese State News,” so why would we expect any truer information in this case?
Fourth, generally one has to establish a criminal intent to successfully prosecute a criminal charge. I haven’t seen a shred of evidence that suggests a criminal intent.
Fifth, aside from your making a statement of moral conviction, how might either the Chinese or the WHO be held accountable? In the World Court? You know that wouldn’t happen. In the market place that China effectively dominates? We could cut off our noses to spite our faces, but China wouldn’t care, because they know we need them more than they need us. Nuke them? Not likely. So where do you take this? How do you hope to settle?
Considering how many Americans are still buying foreign cars and filling them with toys made in China and bought at Walmart, I’m not at all sure that Americans have the stomach to seek compensation for whatever the Chinese and/or the WHO might be responsible for.
Unfortunately, counselor, you haven’t got a case.
@George Wells: I didn’t make a legal case. I made a logical case. Certainly more logical than claiming, like a kicking, screaming child that Trump has blood on his hands.
@Deplorable Me, #105:
They haven’t cited any evidence whatsoever. All they have done is claim that it’s there, and that it’s ENORMOUS. Apparently it’s indescribably enormous—too big and compelling to be put into words.
@retire05: We have managed for 8 years to avoid suicidal deer, we near hit a small black bear last year he busted the brush on a corner it was bolting from something, got to brake just enough to miss its butt, at the time I could’nt believe we missed it. Seems sweetie has it in his head to put in new head and directional lights, I need to condition him further for sticker shock.
Coyotes nasty things, we have added worry about the timber wolves, black bears and a lynx the poodle isnt allowed outside alone at camp.
@kitt:
Couple of years ago a suicidal heifer decided it was time to graze on a yellow line and darted out in front of us. Direct hit. Took out the whole front end of an almost new F350 diesel long bed. It had meandered through a downed fence. Since we don’t live in open range, the owner was responsible for all repairs to the truck and fined for not repairing his fence (neighbor testified it had been down for almost three months so the heifer must have been pretty stupid to take that long to find her escape route).
Coyotes are nasty animals. They will go after a new born calf with a vengeance. Ranchers just shoot them on sight.
@Greg: Have you ever considered using sources other than vapid left wing propaganda to fuel your opinions? IC has been collecting data and that is what the accusations are based on. The left wing practice of just a knee-jerk rejection of anything that comes out of the administration has bitten you in the ass numerous times; you should rethink that immaturity.
@Deplorable Me:
@107:
Thanks for making that clear. The president would appear to be making the “logical” argument you reference, which may have considerable political value – what he really cares about. It is interesting that when there ISN’T a legal case to be made, this president is quick to turn to the court of public opinion where he is a master at manipulating the mob.
That IS “constitutional”, right? If something isn’t legal, just dream up a new way to sneak it by.
@Deplorable Me, #111:
“Vapid left wing propaganda” seems to be how you define anything that doesn’t originate with some right-leaning media site, none of which are trustworthy. They take their cues from the White House, and the truthfulness of the White House can not be trusted. Far too often, they say whatever they deem to be useful.
Horse hockey. The intelligence community has concluded it’s “highly unlikely” that the COVID-19 virus originated in the Wuhan lab. All known evidence points to the virus jumping species, with the initial point of human-to-human spread being the Wuhan market.
Pompeo has taken to parroting Trump’s assertion, but hasn’t said what specific evidence implicates the Wuhan lab—because there isn’t any specific evidence. No one has cited a single specific and credible bit of evidence that the Wuhan bio lab is responsible for the COVID-19 outbreak. If they actually had any such evidence, the Trump administration would make it public.
@Greg: CNN. Fake News.
So, specifically what is this “ENORMOUS evidence” that the Wuhan bio lab is to blame?
Like Barr, Pompeo has become an obedient Trump tool. You either do that or you’re gone. And then you must continue to do it, or you’re gone.
Trump is a fake.
@Greg: It hasn’t been released to the public. However, that doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist; it simply means Schiff doesn’t have it and doesn’t have a political purpose to leak it.
The Obama DOJ was a crime family. They shit all over the reputation of fine organizations and embarrassed this nation, supposedly a beacon of justice and fairness, before the entire world. Obama turned our Justice Department into the Gestapo.
@Greg:
How many times does CNN have to be caught in “fake news” before you realize they do not merit your devotion? Or do you intend to stay a useful idiot the rest of your life?
If Pompeo DOES have “enormous” smoking-gun evidence that the virus came from the Wuhan lab, why WOULDN’T he plaster it up all over town? Why would he NOT take the opportunity to prove CNN to be a purveyor of “fake news”?
As the saying goes, “Old news is no news,” so what is the value of keeping the dirty Wuhan details secret? Did TRUMP fund the Wuhan lab’s coronavirus research? Because that’s the only reason I can think of why the release of Pompeo’s dirt would be embarrassing to our current administration.
Oh, that’s right! The catch-all, cover-up excuse-du-jour: “Can’t say, because it would compromise Top Secret intel sources,” which is just another way of saying “I could tell you, but then I’d have to kill you.” It’s like Pompeo’s speechwriters are getting their script from MAD Magazine’s “Spy-vs-Spy” comics.
Yeah, it’s just a bluff. Pompeo’s holding crap cards and pushing “all-in,” hoping he doesn’t get called. He must like getting caught with his pants down. (That one’s for you, 05 Sweetheart.)
@George Wells: @Greg:
@Deplorable Me:
No. Curt is not Pompeo. Why can’t POMPEO release his enormous, powerful, wonderful, proof? What does it look like when the self-professed most powerful nation in the World has to leak its evidence out through a website that caters to a dozen or so malcontented senior citizens who spend most of their time insulting each other? Come on! If that’s the best we can do, we obviously DON’T have anything!
@George Wells: Why would he until he has all the information compiled and analyzed? I mean… he’s not SCHIFF. They aren’t defending Trump (he doesn’t need defense), they are seeking the facts.
@Deplorable Me:
Then I suppose we should all just hold our breaths until he decides he has enough evidence to share with us, since he evidently doesn’t yet have that. What he has is “enormous” but apparently not yet convincing… Interesting…
Sort of like saying “I have a big secret – I just don’t yet know what it is.”
How could you or I tell the difference?
All this “enormous” evidence swirling around in the ether, just out of reach of anyone who might see it for what it is. How would you know if it wasn’t something injected by Russian hackers or some punk geek with a vivid imagination? Or maybe it came from some of those Obama scum bags. Trump is sounding more and more like mid-level Mafia the closer he gets to November.
@George Wells:
How so?
Did you read the article that was linked #119?
The lab altered the Bat researchers documentation, they were ordered to destroy virus samples, Why would they do that if those samples were not identical to the outbreak? Perhaps they were the stolen viruses from Canada or American bio labs in universities.
China is hiding things and there are ICs all over the planet looking for answers, those ICs talk with our IC ,our IC briefs the President.
You may not remember our spies in China were decimated under the last administration.
@George Wells:
You can hold your breath if you want to; I am not that anxious about it. Then again, I’m not someone foaming at the mouth to blame everything bad that happens everywhere all the time on Trump, so I don’t have the desperation you might.
So, tell me; what is the logical explanation for China reopening the wet market AND allowing the continued sale of bats there if THEY believed that was the source of the spread of the virus? What was the reason for China suppressing information, destroying information, LYING about information about the virus? Because they didn’t want the filthy, nasty wet markets to get a bad reputation?
Of course, now I am waiting with bated breath to see how you change my response THIS time to fit into your own narrative. How exciting.
@kitt:
Did it never occur to you that the Wuhan biolab might have been conducting contract research on the coronavirus paid for by the United States? Pompeo shows every sign of us having dirty hands in this intrigue.
Anybody with a smart keyboard and a connection to the internet can write whatever they like – our Constitution grants them that privilege – and they may post it for the readers of such fiction to enjoy. I get that there are many gullible souls who blindly accept – on FAITH – anything that sounds like it agrees with their political BELIEFS, but I am not so easily misled. I will accept Pompeo’s “enormous” evidence when he EXPOSES it for critical examination and not until then.
You may sequester your conspiracy theory rags where the sun don’t shine.
@Deplorable Me:
Since we no longer have “spies” on the ground over there, and we can’t trust their government any more than we can trust our own, what makes you think you can discover the truth about anything that goes on ANYWHERE. The Democrats are creating their own alternate reality and Trump is muzzling our own experts as fast as he can to hide the truth from the public. I can see both of those things happening every day. What I can’t see is what China did and is doing, and I sure as hell won’t believe an unverified account of it. I don’t KNOW, and I won’t swallow hook, line and sinker what obvious nonsense the Administration chooses to broadcast for public consumption. It’s clear to me that WE don’t know any more than I know, and the airwaves are awash not in truth but in whatever fiction fits the purposes of who’s writing it. So no, I won’t offer you yet another theory. Every imaginable theory has already been put to pen. Believe whatever you want – you’ll sleep better at night. But don’t expect someone else to accept your beliefs as their own simply because you claim to be “sick to your stomach” over the other side’s lies.
@George Wells:
Then you should be all for an investigation.
How so? I trust our government… again. Obama did severe damage to that trust, but it is being restored. Once those responsible for the seditious coup attempted against We the People, that trust will be fully restored.
How so?
Unrelated to the epidemic, in light of the revelations that the Democrats have been lying about every accusation they have leveled at Trump since he declared his candidacy, how is your trust of what the Democrats tell you about the response to the virus or Trump’s performance? Still solid and unshaken?
The actual problem is the lies and coverups perpetrated by the MEDIA. They have lied about Trump’s response, lied about everything Trump says, lied about hydrochloroquine, lied about injecting Lysol and lied about how China has behaved. But YOU distrust Trump. You don’t seem very smart.
@George Wells: It was Faux xi with dirty hands “Back in 2014, the Obama administration prohibited the U.S. from giving money to any laboratory, including in the U.S., that was fooling around with these viruses. Prohibited. Despite that, Dr. Fauci gave $3.7 million to the Wuhan laboratory. And then even after the State Department issued reports about how unsafe that laboratory was, and how suspicious they were in the way they were developing a virus that could be transmitted to humans, we never pulled that money.” Who was SOS in 2014? It was not Pompeo.
No one said we dont have spies in China but they may be not the type that would be useful in medical research intelligence. Leon Panetta was such a sloppy bastid From 2010 through to around 2013, according to The New York Times, more than a dozen carefully curated assets in China were jailed or killed — with one even brazenly shot outside a government building as a perceived warning to others.
Just a few facts to consider, we should not be allowing foreigners into our high technology research labs.
@Deplorable Me:
I guess you forgot what I said AGAINST the liberal media. Do you actually need me to re-post THOSE quotes? I told you before that I don’t trust the media, and that cuts both ways. Only a fool swallows all that he is fed without carefully vetting it first. So how did you vet Curt’s lab lady? See, fool?
@kitt:
You seem to be confirming what I suggested about the US being complicit in the Wuhan Lab’s research into the coronavirus. Maybe that’s why Pompeo says he has enormous evidence, but won’t release it because it would embarrass Trump, who has Fauci on his “team.” I don’t know, because I can’t conclusively prove a blessed thing. I can’t PROVE that Trump diddled Stormy Daniels, even though I can’t think of a sane reason otherwise why he’d pay her $130,000 and make her sign a non-disclosure agreement to that effect. I’m just saying that Pompeo isn’t acting like someone with clean hands, and I’ll NEVER believe that YOU know where his hands have been.
@George Wells: Dont trust Faux xi, not at all, I cant see how Trump could be blamed, this bastid doc has been in the system forever to me a dirty technocrat.
Stormy is a C**t no more than that. No one makes anyone sign anything except the government. The slag had an agreement and thought she could revive her over aged career. Seems two consenting adults not a case of an innocent taken advantage of, her attorney quite a piece of work.
We knew Donny had a reputation, but that type of man is only allowed to be a democrat, like every Kennedy, Johnson, and Clinton? I digress.
Our government healthcare FDA and CDC are less than honest brokers. Often getting jobs in big pharma after their government careers are over.
@kitt: Let us not forget Hillary’s email buffet which the Chinese were reading before SHE read them.
@George Wells: So, you have carefully vetted the reports that Trump bungled the response to COVID19 and still believe it, even though our response was perhaps the best in the world? Yeah, WHO’S the fool? Or, perhaps, useful idiot? You do nothing but parrot the lies from the Democrat media; spend your time trying to convince someone else how open minded and objective you are.
Stormy and her attorney both admit there was no sex. Maybe you should do some more “vetting”.
@kitt:
Our government “jobs” have long had a reputation for overly generous retirement benefits, and I see no reason to expect government employees to NOT take advantage of their rightful benefits. So they often retire somewhere between age 40 and 55. I’m sure that you would agree that this age range isn’t time yet to be put to pasture, right? So they start a second career, and go where they are trained to be useful. Isn’t that how capitalism is supposed to work?
Trump put him on his task force, right? He gets what he paid for.
Your assessment of Stormy C_nt is refreshingly honest when considered beside DM’s. He can’t think of an excuse why Trump paid her – probably even denies THAT. Your take on much of these current events is encouraging similar to my own. I’m just less trusting of ANYONE’S “news” than you are.
@Deplorable Me:
Trump hasn’t been “perfect.”
You can admit that, right?
Surely the liberal media hasn’t let you forget Trump’s “Fifteen cases will go to zero” statement, right?
And that wasn’t his one and only error. He’s been flipping and flopping all along, usually correcting his initially wrong instincts after everyone around him politely pukes.
@George Wells:I never said or even implied I thought Trump was perfect. There you go again.
You still lack the perspective of how the WHO and Chinese lied about the virus in the early phase. But, you NEED to blame and express hate. I understand that.
@Deplorable Me: I think that your definition of “hate” is unusually expansive. I don’t hate Trump. I wouldn’t vote for him if I did. He is simply in over his own head, which wouldn’t be a problem if he understood the fact. The truth is that he doesn’t know when to shut his pie trap until his handlers tell him to, and often enough he has to be told repeatedly.
As far as the Chinese are concerned, did I EVER characterize the Chinese as honest? Of COURSE they lie! So do ALL governments, ALL political parties and ALL people. And because I am not perfect, I can’t sit in judgement and decide whose lies are the worst, so I don’t play that game. It is a lie itself.
And as for the WHO, I never trusted the World Court, the United Nations, or the European Union. Whether we financially support foreign organizations or not, their agendas are not ours, and I have no reason to believe what any of them say or stand for. So what other “perspective” do you want me to have? Nuke them?
You keep harping on this dead horse as if you can squeeze blood from this turnip. You can’t. Bury it!
@George Wells: Yes he put Faux xi on the team, he might still not realize he has been had by the globalists but but seems he might be catching on.
How many people when beginning a second career walk into high 6 figure salaries? After approving drugs that cause cancer look to our government.
got 25 minutes? https://plandemicmovie.com/
Beware it breaks twitters terms of service.
We need certain laws repealed, the one that protects vaxx companies from being sued for damages and one that allows government financed research to be patented by universities and researchers.
@kitt:
Can’t say, but RHIP, and government is rank-rich.
I feel your legal and patent pain. It’s set up to “stimulate” business. There are always winners and losers. It’s the American way!
I have to go now. My cat is tired of “social distancing” and is sitting on my lap demanding quality attention. It’s good to have someone who cares…