I’m more than likely going to get left behind:
We thought there was more time to get ready for the Judgment Day that evangelical radio broadcaster Harold Camping predicts is coming on Saturday.
But now we read in The Atlantic that Camping says the Rapture will actually get started when the clock hits 6 p.m. Saturday at the international dateline way out in the Pacific. And then, according to The Atlantic, it will spread “like a rolling brown out” as earthquakes and other disasters start happening around the world.
By The Atlantic‘s reckoning, things will get going at 11 p.m. tonight on the West Coast of the U.S., or 2 a.m. Saturday on the East Coast.
Uh oh…
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXRrVrkFYlo[/youtube]
“No one knows when that day or hour will come-not the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father…and Harold Camping”-Matthew 24:36
For those of us left behind, see ya October 21st!
….Or maybe the end of the world happens in 2012, after the presidential election.
So…what does everyone have planned for this weekend? Would love to hear the revelation!
Clinton Goes to Hell
One day in the future, Bill Clinton has a heart attack and dies. He immediately goes to hell, where the devil is waiting for him. “I don’t know what to do here,” says the devil. “You are on my list, but I have no room for you. You definitely have to stay here, so I’ll tell you what I’m going to do. I’ve got a couple folks here who weren’t quite as bad as you. I’ll let one of them go, but you have to take their place. I’ll even let you decide who leaves.”
Clinton thought that sounded pretty good, so the devil opened the first room. In it was Ted Kennedy and a large pool of water. He kept diving in and surfacing empty handed. Over and over and over. Such was his fate in hell. “No,” Bill said. “I don’t think so. I’m not a good swimmer and I don’t think I could do that all day long.”
So the devil led him to the next room. In it was Newt Gingrich with a sledgehammer and a room full of rocks. All he did was swing that hammer, time after time after time. “No, I’ve got this problem with my shoulder. I would be in constant agony if all I could do was break rocks all day,” commented Bill.
The devil opened a third door. In it, Clinton saw Jesse Jackson lying on the floor with his arms staked over his head, and his legs staked in a spread eagle pose. Bent over him was Monica Lewinsky, doing what she does best. Clinton took this in in disbelief and finally said, “Yea, I can handle this.”
The devil smiled and said “OK, Monica, you’re free to go!”
Joke about Bush, Obama, and Hell
George Bush, Queen Elizabeth, and Vladimir Putin all die and go to hell. While there, they spy a red phone and ask what the phone is for. The devil tells them it is for calling back to Earth. Putin asks to call Russia and talks for 5 minutes. When he was finished the devil informs him that the, cost is a million dollars, so Putin writes him a check. Next Queen Elizabeth calls England and talks for 30 minutes. When she finished, the devil informs her that cost is 6 million dollars, so Queen, Elizabeth writes him a check. Finally George Bush gets his turn and talks for 4 hours. When he was finished the devil informed him that there would be no charge for the call and feel free to call the USA anytime. When Putin hears this he goes ballistic and asks the devil why Bush got to call the USA free. The devil replied, “Since Obama became president of the USA , the country has gone to hell, so naturally it’s a local call.”
A former fetus, the “wordsmith from nantucket” was born in Phoenix, Arizona in 1968. Adopted at birth, wordsmith grew up a military brat. He achieved his B.A. in English from the University of California, Los Angeles (graduating in the top 97% of his class), where he also competed rings for the UCLA mens gymnastics team. The events of 9/11 woke him from his political slumber and malaise. Currently a personal trainer and gymnastics coach.
The wordsmith has never been to Nantucket.
This is simply something coming out of the south end of a horse traveling north. These same people have done it before to raise money. Nothing but a scam.
Scripture has decidedly clear signposts that point towards the second coming of Christ. It is surprising how many fringe groups who call themselves Christians prefer to dump scripture for their own prognostications.
If those signposts are to be believed, we certainly are in the general time leading up to His return. I believe we can look at the 38th chapter of Ezekiel for the outline of an event that has to happen years Before His return. It is when Israel/Jerusalem, a ‘city without walls’, is encompassed by it’s enemies and under imminent attack, in the latter days.
Sit down and have a read.
and Word….nice jokes..:-)
Jesus is coming. Everybody look busy.
(I think I got this one from the same web site as you got your first Clinton joke):
Clinton and the Pope
Bill Clinton and the Pope die on the same day, but a mixup in the afterlife paperwork sends them to the wrong places: the Pope goes to hell and Bill goes to heaven. After a couple of days they fix this problem and the Pope gets on the escalator to go to heaven and Bill gets on the other to go to hell. The two pass each other on the way and Bill asks, “How bad was it down there?” The Pope says, “Not that bad, kind of hot and noisy, but I am glad to be going up to heaven now. There’s one thing up there I have been looking forward to.” Bill asks, “What is that?” The Pope replies, “I want to meet the Virgin Mary.” Bill, shakes his head sheepishly and whispers to the Pope, “Too late.”
In the few minutes I heard Rush today while driving, he reminded his audience of Michael Crighton’s analogy/comparison of global warming fanatics and christianity: sin, penance, redemption, and eternal life (for better or worse), making the point that they are both “religions.”
Bottom line, we all have our “religion”, be it based on sacred scripture, the ‘silliness’ of scripture, junk science, good science, wishful thinking, addictitions, or whatever one clings to in life.
To quote an overused cliche (which actually fits in this case), at the “end of the day”, we are all one day closer to the “end times.”
Never mind that the “rapture” has nothing to do with Christianity or Scripture, doomsday always sells.
LOL Patricia. Well, one major difference is that at least most Christians believe in a Rapture and an escape, while the AGW crowd has “Capture”… as in carbon credits…. and a padding of their wallets.
Rapture is another made up term by Christian fundamentalists. It is cute when in fiction books, but is always exposed as a fraud when an actual date is used.
I’ll be buying my asbestos suit. I’d like to beat the rush.
@Patricia:
Actually the rapture Does have to do with Christianity, not that I necessarily cater to it, however, it is a distinct part.
Sorry Esdraelon, according to Scripture, there is only ONE “2nd coming”, not special “raptures” for loony book selling purposes (Left Behind).
I have no desire to get into a biblical debate, only making the same point as Blast that the “rapture” was invented by Christian fundamentalists. Actually, it’s quite blasphamous for anyone to think they “know” being that Jesus clearly taught that the end would come like a “thief in the night”, something only the Father knows.
Buy hey, as I said, doomsday sells. It’s just that the only thing “left behind” are going to be empty wallets!
@Patricia:
Oh, I’m assuredly not getting into a debate. The rapture is not the second coming. The second coming is outlined in the Revelation, if you happen to believe that. I simply pointed out that it IS a distinct doctrine of Christianity, especially in the South, though I have never put a lot of stock in it.
On Monday, its Victoria Day for us and thus, a long weekend. We’ll be in hoodoo country( Roadrunner and Wile E. Coyote terrain) which is east of Drumheller( private land). We finally got our Mcmillan Tac 50 rifle and all sorts of ammunition to play test. The atvs and bikes are all loaded and the rotties, pit bulls, and labs are all excited, because they sense fun time is coming up. No booze and rifles. An authorized armorer is going to show up Sunday for fine tuning. Its going to be a praise the lord and pass the ammunition weekend.
The Lord Jesus is going to return a the last day whenever that is and that is all there is. the present age will be over with and at that day will be the seperating of the sheep and goats. from the book of Daniel and the book of John.
If someone can find biblical proof of the rapture I will give you five dollars.
Well, this is one Christian who won’t spend time debating an unscriptural doctrine with folks when I could be going to my local record store for their ”End of the World” sale.
It is supposed to be a really good sale!
And then there’s a new Jesse Stone mystery on CBS Sunday night at 9 pm.
I just don’t miss those.
Greetings Zac,
How’s this?
“For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not precede them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
Then we which are alive and remain shall be caughtt up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. ” 1Thes. 4: 14-16
The Greek term Paul uses for “caught up” is “ἁρπάζω”, pronounced “harpazō”, which means to “snatch” or “seize by force”.
When Jerome compiled the Latin Vulgate in the late 4th and early 5th Century, he used the latin verb most closely aligned with the greek “ἁρπάζω”, namely “rapiemur”, which comes from: rapio, rapere, rapui, raptus. (from which we get rapture)
Hence the Vulgate passage reads as follows:
4:17 deinde nos qui vivimus qui relinquimur simul rapiemur c*um illis in nubibus obviam Domino in aera et sic semper cu*m Domino erimus
:17 then we that are alive, that are left, shall together with them be caught up in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
So is the “Rapture” in Scripture? You bet your rapiemur it is. Now how you exegete the passage and develop a theological framework for it is another thing entirely. Therein lies the rub.
My question to you is: Will you be paying by cash or check?
In Christ,
Ariel
Not so fast there Ariel. You used a Catholic translation, which in proper Catholic context, refers to the “one and only” 2nd coming of Christ, not the fictitious “rapture” invented by the left behind crowd.
If anything, you prove the point of how “unscriptual” it is, since the fundamentalists , famous for “cherry picking”, use the Catholic translation and disregard the context. Being that Catholic teaching doesn’t teach “the rapture” save for everyone at the 2nd and last coming, it makes no sense to say it’s scriptual.
I’m with Nan, cashing in on the end of the world sales!
Hard Right, do you mean beat RUSH LIMBAW?.
you well know that ASBESTOS will shorthen your life, as it”s poisenous?
Ariel, hi, the way you mentionned it ,
look like a terrorist attacking a plane,
be caught up in the air, sound familiar
Nan G , yes go on and watch your movie like it’s the last one,
you’ll ever see
Zac, It’s worth more than that
Patricia, you know he could get shot by OIL GUY FROM ALBERTA,
if he come like a thief,
@ilovebeeswarzone:
Bees, I don’t know if Rush will need a fireproof suit, but many others will. I’m counting myself among those likely to need one.
As for longevity, if I’m in hell, the lifespan problem is solved. 😉
Really, I shouldn’t need one. As I live in AZ, I expect hell to be only a little hotter than what I’m used to.
Well goodnight all. Don’t let the rapture bite.
The way I understand it, the rapture is by invitation only, and I ain’t got mine yet, so I guess I will be one of the ones left behind.
the “rapture” was first put out in the 19th century. How many people knew that? and John Nelson Darby is the one who really pushed it forward. I would suggest going to read the book. “the Apocalypse Code” written by Hank Hanegraaff.
When i croak i am going to see the Lord face to face just as the Bible says. period and not because i am a good person. Only because i trust in the Lord Jesus my great Redeemer.
Doing anything special? Well my youngest son is 1 yrs old today but he’s missing his mummy because she’s in hospital due to a operation she had yesterday on her throat but should be back tomorrow (if the world doesn’t end). Not easy looking after 3 boys under 3 years of age! Still hoping the world doesn’t end as I’m starting a new job in London – so moving back to the UK. As a borderline atheist/agnostic I’m pretty sure I won’t be one of the unlucky ones who get to descend up to heaven and be stuck with fellow fundamentalist Christians. I wonder what lame excuse Harold Camping is going to use when the Rapture doesn’t happen?
Patricia and roger o have made such great points, of course bees has out done them in the humor department (as usual) and wordsmith is a close second. So that being said, I’m not quite ready to hand my five dollars out willingly.
By the way, I understand roger to be right, the concept behind the rapture is a very recent phenomenon.
The recriminations are starting to roll in, e.g. one of them the first comment on this thread, to wit:
Basically, the charge is that Camping built up a ministry based on “Rapture Theology,” and, over the years, raked in many millions of dollars in donations and from other sources. All for selling something which didn’t turn out to be true.
Giving Camping the benefit of the doubt (i.e. that he really believed what he was preaching), I don’t see how he would be deserving of the term “scam artist.” How different would be be from any other religious messenger who ever lived — all giving public witness (and often earning livelihoods) — from spreading their own versions of “the true religion.”
Likewise, how many so-called messengers of God (preachers, priests, rabbis, lamas, mullahs, and other assorted clerics) have, deep in their hearts, not really believed in their own messages, readings, sermons, and rituals, yet earned a livelihood from their chosen occupation? I’d put this number at millions, including a great many who are still at it — in pulpits, cathedrals, and temples the world over, and on the airwaves and in cyberspace.
The starkest difference between Camping and all the other Men (and Women) of God is that the actual truth or fiction of Camping’s preaching actually received an antemortem, black and white test. Whether other prophets and religious teachers preach truth or myth is never tested on this side of the Great Divide.
– Larry Weisenthal/Huntington Beach, CA
Larry you make an excellent point, and validate Michael Crighton, who believed that Al Gore (and the AGW crowd) was/is as “religious” as Billy Graham. However, most would probably conclude, at least based on behavior, that Billy Graham lives what he preaches. Al Gore on the other hand, couldn’t possibly take this stuff seriously simply based on his lifestyle of big homes and private jets.
As for the “black and white” proof, that would be counter to faith itself, as the whole point is to believe and trust in something bigger than ourselves, that’s why it’s “faith” and not certitude (it’s in the faith that we DO eventually get the certitude). While no one can be certain with proof where any of us end up, we DO have examples of “faith in action”, for better or for worse, i.e., Mother Theresa, Ghandi, Bin Laden, Pope John Paul II, CS Lewis… There is no question that the Christians among the group left the world a better place. Bin Laden, not so much.
On a side note, I worked a graveyard shift last night at a medical center. I’m pretty sure we broke ER records last night as it was truly the most traumas I had ever experienced at one time, all but one of them drug and or alcohol related. My guess is that the accidents were mostly related to “end of the world parties.” Sadly in that sense, some DID get “raptured” last night.
Patricia, this is another great comment of your’s, please keep them comming,
Wordsmith hi, such a good POST AGAIN,for us to reflect on our end of our world,
we seem to behave that we are eternal most of the time, but IT’S a good thing to step back
and you provided the tools for refexion on each of our day left, to try better.
thank you Patricia , and Wordsmith.
So say everyone does get “caught up” in clouds (on heaven or earth?..) Where is the part that says when that will happen, as they tell us its prior to judgment day, where is the scripture? That one is just a bit to much of a long shot. Of course I would not mind if the evangelical christian hippsters down the street disappeared, I just can’t find any nice way to get those kids to leave me alone, for that reason I would be grateful with the rapture.
Larry:
It appears certain that you would like to bolster your own unbelief and intellectual comeuppance over those who do believe with such statements, making a smug presumption attempting to call to question the sincerity of the beliefs of those ministers, clerics, and others “just making money” of the issue and not really believing what they preach.
You would like to accuse others of living in a fantasy world when you live in one of your own where the worlds population agrees with you rather than practically 86% of them disagreeing. You are welcome to you opinion, however, such viewpoint simply magnifies the vapidness or the rest of your ‘opinions’ expressed in these pages.
It is curious that most of your ilk posturing upon this subject are flying completely by the seat of their pants, not knowing the first part of what they claim to know and assuming that the more they posture, the greater the impression will be that they are the worlds repositories of intellectual acumen.
Aside from this ‘rapture’ thing, however, let me point out something to you: don’t you find it extremely curious that up until May 1948, the worlds Christians, for instance, fervently believed the prophecies of the bible even though the focal point of those prophecies, Israel, did not exist?
Well, now it does, bringing back to the forefront the end-times prophecies of Israel and the surrounding Arab states. Your disdain, ignorance, and disregard of the issue, notwithstanding, does not change the fact, nor does your disdain, ignorance and disregard of those who believe in Jesus Christ likewise changes nothing but your attempt to exhibit a scholarly understanding of the matter Does Not exist.
Now, about this ‘rapture’, it is a very recent phenomenon with respect to the biblical timeline of thousands of years, coming about in the 19th century. It based upon specific verses in the bible, but one has to stretch a bit into the supernatural in order to gather what it is about. I, for one, prefer to see as much of the ‘natural’ as can be seen in scripture before I begin looking at it from the supernatural. The basic question is whether the church will be taken off the world or will it have to go through the great tribulation with the rest of mankind? That is what the ‘rapture’ is all about. As I see it, the church will endure the great tribulation here on earth, but there is scripture suggesting that it will not.
The basic misunderstanding of the Second Coming of Christ is to what purpose there is a second coming. There are prophecies in the Old Testament, Ezekiel, Chapter 38, the Book of Daniel, etc, the specifically relate to the end times, curiously focused right there at Israel and the surrounding Arab states. The prophecy is also quite clear and takes very little ‘interpretation’. What we have is a final battle situated in the Middle East, called Armageddon (which is simply a word describing the location: Armageddon is the Anglicized form of the word Har-magedon, which is found only one time in the Bible. It is found at Revelation 16:16. In most dictionaries the meaning of this word is said to mean “mountain of Megiddo.” and that Megiddo was a strategic location in the ancient Middle East where many decisive battles were fought. Interestingly, there is no literal “mountain” of Megiddo.
The point is, however, that this will be the scene of a final world war and it precipitates the return of Christ to save man from himself. Yes, sir, this will be a nuclear war, and a war to end all wars. Most think it is unthinkable, but the bible, that mythology, points right at the flashpoint: Israel. Coincidence? I think not. If the bible focused on some other area of the world, like Eastern Europe, for instance, I can see why it would easily be disregarded, however, curiously, its right there where it proports to be.
Of course, this is just my ‘opinion’, however, I guarantee it is based on far more study and discernment that your nonsense about whether these people who follow Jesus Christ, and teach the Scriptures are hypocrites. That’s your OPINION, and a rather baseless one.
Esdraelon, thank you for that
@Esdraelon:
You doth protest too much.
Certainly, you can’t deny that there are a great many true believers in false faiths. Giving Camping the benefit of doubt, he was simply just another true believer in a false faith.
Likewise, you can’t deny that there are a great many false believers in whatever you profess to be your own true faith. These would be people who don’t believe it it themselves, but who none-the-less profess not only to believe, but to become a (paid) leader of others who truly do believe. Throughout the history of all religions, including Christianity, there have been false believers who became rich at the expense of true believers.
I was also simply making the point that the main difference between Camping and all of the above examples is that Camping actually subjected his preachings to an antemortem, black and white test, while all of the others preach of things which are untestable, in this life before death.
I made no comment at all concerning true believers in a true faith.
– Larry Weisenthal/Huntington Beach, CA
1 Thessalonians 4:17 is the SINGLE Scripture used to justify THE RAPTURE by false doctrine. Based on Scripture, you cannot make a doctrine on a SINGLE Scripture. The word RAPTURE does not appear in the text of any translation of the Bible, in any language.
“CAUGHT UP” are the words used by many when referring to THE RAPTURE. King James must have missed this one because the words “CAUGHT UP” are not found in the Young’s Concordance for 1 Thessalonians 4:17. However, “CATCH” is listed under that Scripture. That word appears 13 times, and is translated six different ways: catch, catch away, catch (caught) up, pluck and take by force. In the 12 other Scriptures, it has nothing to do with the physical removal of living people from the earth/world to heaven.
Also in THE RAPTURE CHAPTER, 1 Thessalonians 4:17, is to meet the lord IN THE AIR. According to the Strong’s and Young’s concordance, “AIR” is the Greek word “AER”, as used in the following Scriptures:
Acts 22:23, …and threw dust into the air (AER).
1 Corinthians 9:26, …not as one who beateth the air (AER).
1 Corinthians 14:9, …for ye shall speak in the air (AER).
Another Greek word which is also translated, AIR, in the KJV of the Bible is OURANOS. That translation is found in Matthew 6:26, 8:20, 13:32; Mark 4:4 and 32; Luke 8:5, 9:58, 13:19 and Acts 10:12, 11:6. Each one of these Scriptures refer to “the birds/fowls of the air (ouranos).
Grab a handful of dirt and throw it into the air. That’s about where you would be hanging IF there were to be a RAPTURE, based on the recorded meaning of the word AIR.
Next we have the phrase “with them in the CLOUDS”. If you look outside, you can see the clouds WAY UP there. BUT, is that what the Scripture means? No.
In the following Scriptures, the CLOUD came DOWN to earth:
Matthew 17:5; Mark 9:7; Luke 9:34
In 1Corinthians 10:1,2, they were UNDER the CLOUD, and were baptized IN the CLOUD.
Hebrews 11:36 through 12:2 talks about SO GREAT A CLOUD OF WITNESSES.
With all of the above, let us read 1 Thessalonians 4, beginning at verse 13, with a much more accurate and clearer understanding of the words and terms used therein. For clarity, the following Scripture quotes from 1 Thessalonians are in capital letters.
“BUT I WOULD NOT HAVE YOU IGNORANT, BRETHREN, CONCERNING THEM WHICH ARE ASLEEP (this Scripture is primarily about the departed/dead saints in Christ) THAT YE SORROW NOT, EVEN AS OTHERS WHICH HAVE NO HOPE (the Sadducees did not believe in a resurrection). FOR IF WE BELIEVE THAT JESUS DIED AND ROSE AGAIN (we all believe that), EVEN SO (in like manner) THEM ALSO WHICH SLEEP (are dead) IN JESUS WILL GOD BRING WITH HIM (Jesus). FOR THIS WE SAY UNTO YOU BY THE WORD OF THE LORD, THAT WE (Biblical believers) WHO ARE ALIVE AND REMAIN (on earth) UNTO THE COMING OF THE LORD SHALL NOT PREVENT (precede) (have any advantage over) THEM WHICH ARE ASLEEP. FOR THE LORD HIMSELF SHALL DESCEND FROM HEAVEN (Acts 1:11, Jesus went directly from earth to Heaven and shall return “in like manner” directly from Heaven to earth. No rapture back to heaven for a later third coming!) WITH A SHOUT, WITH THE VOICE OF THE ARCHANGEL, AND THE TRUMP(et) OF GOD: AND THE DEAD IN CHRIST SHALL RISE (Greek word, anistemi: to set up or be resurrected) FIRST: THEN WE WHO ARE ALIVE (“We shall not all die, but shall be changed/transformed/transfigured” (1 Cor 15:51) AND REMAIN (on the earth in the “aer”) SHALL BE CAUGHT UP (made one) (harpazo) TOGETHER (at the same time) WITH THEM (the dead in Christ) IN THE CLOUDS TO MEET THE LORD IN THE AIR (the “great cloud of witnesses” that will “be made perfect” with us on earth when Jesus brings their spirits “with Him” to be united with their bodies resurrected out of the ground “first” into the air [aer] with us in the air, on the surface of the earth): AND SO SHALL WE (for) EVER BE WITH THE LORD (in the air [aer] here ON earth forever). WHEREFORE, COMFORT (reassure) ONE ANOTHER WITH THESE WORDS.” (Notice, the Lord “descended from Heaven” before we are “caught up” to Him; just as the “New Jerusalem” came down to dwell with us–Rev. 21:2.)
@Zac:
May I asked where you copied and pasted this from, however, I agree that doctrine should not be based upon a single verse, and I also tend to take the view that the rapture as it is believed is very questionable.
There are a couple of other verses, though.
1 Thessalonians 4:16-18, “For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet of God; and the dead in Christ shall rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and thus we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words.”
1 Corinthians 15:20-23, “But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep. 21 For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all shall be made alive. 23 But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ’s at His coming.”
1 Cor. 15:51-52, “Behold, I tell you a mystery; we shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet; for the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.”
Actually I don’t see where the last verse coincides with that of the Revelation where it is clearly pointed out that Christ will come to the earth at the final battle to set up his kingdom afterward. There will come a time where there is the ‘last trump’, but there is no mention of this other than the White Throne judgments at some time beyond that.
@openid.aol.com/runnswim:
I tend to do that at times.
Of course, the world has plenty of wolves in sheep’s clothing, of that I don’t disagree.
It depends on what you imply is a ‘false’ religion, or simply a ‘perversion’ of a ‘true’ religion. It takes very little to make such accusations, certainly not the intelligence of a rocket scientist.
Such was prevalent even back in the times of Christ: Mark 8:36- “For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?”
They have their reward….
Certainly Esd, I was going to rewrite it but unfortunately ran out of time. I was hoping to get a few more responses before this thread becomes obsolete and I proved no one would likely get my five dollars. Of course even if the thes scripture is a proven “rapture” scripture there is a lot to refute the pre tribulation rapture in other scripture but I’m out of time, be back later.
http://www.demonbuster.com/rapture.html
@Zac:
Thanks, Zac, actually I am not making a defense, simply pointing out where the doctrine comes from.
Per your link, the first thing I like to do on links is to find out Who Posted It, who they are, what they believe, what is their motive, etc, etc. Demonbuster, has some kooky stuff of their own on that site, though it can always be said that they may get some things right..
The point is, I approach the whole matter is if there will Not be a rapture. If there is, fine, if not, won’t make any difference other than to very drastically test my faith in the times coming. In many ways, I look forward to that….is my faith ‘real’ or is it a ‘crutch’? Somethings we get a ‘Revelation’…
Zac, It could be interpreted as ALIENS which have been HUMAN and died and became alliens by having been transfigured will come from the air, with JESUS which is the SON OF GOD THE CREATOR OF ALL WHICH IS ON EARTH AND IN THE AIR, LIKE OTHER STARS AND PLANET MULTIPLE DIFFRENT OTHER PLACE WHERE THE DEADS OF THE EARTH COULD HAVE END UP AND ABLE TO LIVE WITHOUT
THEIR HUMAN BODYS, WILL BE SUMMONS BY THE MASTER, JESUS TO COME DOWN TO BE HELPING THE HUMANS TO SOLVE THEIR PROBLEMS HAVING BEEN IN THOSE OTHER PLACES AND ACQUIRED THE STAGE OF TOTAL PERFECTION FROM BEINGS FROM HIGHER DEGREES OF KNOWLEDGE
JUST THINKING, AH YES I wanted to mention of the BEAST TO BE CAST OUT
WITH HIS FOLLOWERS IN THE FIRE IN A BIG BATTLE
Bees I think that’s is the best and most creative explanation I’ve heard. aliens are pretty cool, so are dinosaurs, both make for a great Stephen Spielberg movie and both possibly can be used to decipher certain bible verse. Truthfully when I read a bible verse in such old english I nearly get a headache trying to understand it.
If you can read this…YOU ARE STILL HERE!
I was tempted to go and lay some of my clothing outside my front door. Thought it would be funny.
I’m considering starting a myth about reverse rapture. It’s where your clothes (and your soul) go to hell and your dead naked body is left here.
Here’s one from the what if paranoia department. What if the number of people “raptured” is so small we don’t know it actually happened?
Zac, thank you, but I was just outstage by Hard Right,’s comment
darn
@Larry
Aren’t all religions fake? At least what evidence do we have that a single one of them is true? The bigger religions at least have the sense to make vague predictions without naming specific dates that are going to happen in our lifetime.
Two albums I bought at the ”End of the World” sale were somewhat spiritual.
One was a George Harrison album, you know, with sitars and My Sweet Lord on it.
The other was a Yes album, Tales from Topographic Oceans.
Just listened to that again for the first time in over 20 years.
Seems when my music tastes turn to spiritual at all, they lean Eastward.
Just a couple minutes ago, I had a sudden blackout and when I awoke I saw a bright light, many bright lights as if to say “come to me my son”. There was a feeling like rain, rain from heaven above, I could feel it dripping across my numb body. I could not even remember what I was doing when it happened. Euphoria! I knew I had been raptured! I was going on to be with the lord. Then the pain set in… Turns out I had not been raptured at all but slipped in the shower and momentarily knocked myself out.
Zac, you cannot go on slipping to many times more,
the shower is a worse place to enter to paradise, because getting in nude will not be well received
by ANGELIC beings
If I get to heaven and have to stand before the lord and speak for all the sins I’ve committed I would like to be in a tuxedo or something spiffy, as I have some things to answer for and I think looking good will help.
That’s a healthy concern to have Bees. I certainly will be mindful of what I’m wearing in the future, if I feel I’m about to kick the bucket. I would not want G-d to think I was sent to the wrong place. Or yell out to an angel “hey you! Get over here and get some clothes on this boy. Jesus this kid is ugly! No, no, not you jesus, I mean the kid.” Then look to me and say “did I invent you? Uhh sorry about that mole, I’m sure now that your dead and naked we can have somebody fix that. Awkward…”
Zac can you forsee the angels broohaha, pushing to get in front to get the job done properly
@gaffa (#44). I’d recommend Vincent Bugliosi’s “Divinity of Doubt.” He’s not a believer, but he carefully examines the arguments made in prominent books about atheism and finds assertions of atheism to be — objectively — as indefensible as assertions of the truth of any specific organized religion.
In my youth, my grandmother sent me to a Baptist summer camp and, a couple of years later, I had a “born again” experience, which was as true to me as anyone else’s. It stayed with me for years, but gradually faded away, after I reached adulthood. But it’s something about which I’ve always had intense interest.
As an almost senior citizen, and fallen away born againer, here’s what I’ve decided.
There is so much about the universe that we don’t know — literally. We do know that most of the universe is made up of dark matter and dark energy. We know that string theory posits multiple dimensions beyond the four dimensions we are capable of perceiving. What comprises that matter? What is in that energy? What is in those dimensions? As humans, we can’t understand what is beyond infinity and what was before the beginning. There is so much that we don’t know, that it’s arrogant to conclude that all religions are wrong and that there is no possibility that what is called God doesn’t exist.
As a physician, I’m interested in studies relating to health and longevity. It’s interesting that objective research has shown that people who define themselves as being “spiritual” live, on the average, 2 years longer than those who define themselves as not being “spiritual.” If we were to cure all forms of cancer today, average life expectancy would only improve by 2 years. So being “spiritual” provides as much of a health benefit as being immune from cancer.
I continue to pray, and each and every prayer I say gets answered. I only say two types of prayers, however. The first is “thank you” — most frequently thank you for my wife (the best person currently living on this planet). I never say “thank you” in a way to curry future favors. Just out of a sense of genuine gratitude. The second prayer is “give me strength,” as in “give me strength to do what I know to be the right thing.” This prayer has always been answered. If and when it ever fails me, it will forever be worthless to me, and I can’t take that chance — the prayer is too important to me ever to lose it.
Beyond that, I don’t let myself ever disrespect any religion which does not do evil nor advocate evil. I don’t know enough to know that the unprovable is wrong or if it is right. It’s a matter of faith, and, though I may lack that faith, that doesn’t mean that those who have that faith are wrong. It’s ultimately unknowable, and I despise certitude in virtually all forms.
– Larry Weisenthal/Huntington Beach, CA
Hey Folks!
Well, I just got back recently from the Rapture. It was awesome! But after only a few hours into it, I realized “Oh crap! I haven’t done the Sunday Funnies yet!”
So I came back to be amongst the 97 per centers left behind.
You’re welcome.