You gotta love the irony when one of the Wisconsin fleebaggers says something like this in response to the Wisconsin Senate passing a bill to strip collective bargaining from public employee unions:
What Republicans did was an affront to democracy. Never shall a voter doubt which party stands for the working class, and which for the rich
An affront to democracy? No. An affront to Democracy is the Democrats refusing to participate in that democracy and running to another state.
THAT’S an affront.
But this? No way. The fleebaggers basically made the case for the Wisconsin Republicans when one said:
Democrats said the fines would have no effect on bringing them back to the state.
“They’ve messed with our staffs,” said Sen. Jon Erpenbach (D-Middleton). “They’ve taken away our parking spaces. They’ve extorted our paychecks. They’ve sent the State Patrol after us. And now they’ve fined us $100 a day.
“I don’t know what more they need to do to get the point that it’s not working.”
Walker and the Republicans now understood….the Democrats would continue to hide like little weasels.
This afternoon, following a week and a half of line-by-line negotiation, Sen. Miller sent me a letter that offered three options: 1) keep collective bargaining as is with no changes, 2) take our counter-offer, which would keep collective bargaining as is with no changes, 3) or stop talking altogether.
With that letter, I realized that we’re dealing with someone who is stalling indefinitely, and doesn’t have a plan or an intention to return. His idea of compromise is “give me everything I want,” and the only negotiating he’s doing is through the media.
Enough is enough.
So they did what needed to be done….take collective bargaining off the table, and now they have no reason to hide anymore.
Senate Minority Leader Mark Miller (D-Monona) said they would be back by Thursday. They had been able to block a vote on the bill for three weeks because 20 senators had to be present to vote for it. Republicans control the house 19-14…
Democrats decried the move and warned it could end the political careers of some Republican senators who are under the threat of recall.
“I think it’s akin to political hara-kiri,” said Sen. Bob Jauch (D-Poplar). “I think it’s political suicide.”…
State Sen. Chris Larson (D-Milwaukee) said Wednesday night he attempted to drive back from Illinois to Madison to get to the Capitol before Republicans passed the measure.
Political hara-kiri? Hmmmm, we shall see. I know they have a LOT of supporters but if the recall effort, being driven by Obama, does succeed then at least they will go out with pride and many of this country cheering for them. They finally showed WHO in the Republican party had the balls to get what needed to be done.
Exit quote from Scott Walker:
While it might be a bold political move, the changes are modest. We ask government workers to make a 5.8% contribution to their pensions and a 12.6% contribution to their health-insurance premium, both of which are well below what other workers pay for benefits. Our plan calls for Wisconsin state workers to contribute half of what federal employees pay for their health-insurance premiums. (It’s also worth noting that most federal workers don’t have collective bargaining for wages and benefits.)
For example, my brother works as a banquet manager at a hotel and occasionally works as a bartender. My sister-in-law works at a department store. They have two beautiful kids. They are a typical middle-class Wisconsin family. At the start of this debate, David reminded me that he pays nearly $800 per month for his family’s health-insurance premium and a modest 401(k) contribution. He said most workers in Wisconsin would love a deal like the one we are proposing.
The unions say they are ready to accept concessions, yet their actions speak louder than words. Over the past three weeks, local unions across the state have pursued contracts without new pension or health-insurance contributions. Their rhetoric does not match their record on this issue.
Oh, btw….the assembly votes on the bill tomorrow and since the police have pathetically given ground, a mob of protesters were allowed to take over the capitol building. Can you believe that? They are staying the night and Thursday should be interesting:
Gear up for Thursday if you’re in the area, grab a camera and get some pictures of the dummies acting like idiots….example here:
And be assured, the left is gearing up for the fight:
• Legal challenges. There are going to be a number of legal challenges to this bill. It will not be implemented right away. There’s the near-term challenge of how the bill got passed tonight…
• Supreme Court fight. The matchup between David Prosser (R) and JoAnn Kloppenberg (D) for the state Supreme Court on April 5 just got very interesting. It’s a statewide vote, and the balance of power on the state Supreme Court is at stake…
• General strike. Union leaders are reportedly discussing a general strike…
• Recalls. This will only energize progressives and labor to get the required signatures for recalls….
• Scott Walker. If his approval ratings were slipping before, they may fall off a cliff now. Walker cannot be recalled until January 2012, and that’s a long way off. But depending on the momentum from the state Supreme Court election, recall elections, Assembly open seats, and legal fights, there could easily be enough support to recall Walker by then.
The legal fights won’t go anywhere but the Supreme Court issue and the recalls have to be a worry to Walker and the Republicans since you can bet your ass the special interest unions from all over will be sending them cash by the truckloads.
See author page
Hmm, such a peaceful little group…
All it takes are enough signatures. There’s going to be very little problem with that now. Walker has stepped on it big time. It may take a while for the message to finally reach his brain.
Let’s ignore the fact that WI Union members who voted in the 2010 elections were split nearly 50/50 between the political parties for a second…
I’m pretty sure Governor Walker has changed that 50/50 split over the past couple of weeks.
I’m pretty sure Democrats abandoning the State and taking Union monies to assist the weakened Economy of another State has changed that 50/50 split with the non-Public Sector Citizens.
Life is hard when you’re stupid.
@Greg: Greg,
When waitresses and fast food workers and the other little people learn that teachers are fighting for Viagra benefits and the right to extort the state for far more than their current $100,000 plus salaries for nine months work that recall thing isn’t is going far. When people learn that they are funding the Democrat party with their tax money the dawn will come.
The second vid shows typical mob mentality in the unions, then run off as lemmings blindly into the Capitol. What kills me is their demanding these so called rights, yet are harassing an individual who believes differently than them, basically borderline infringing on his right to video the ordeal, yet are video taping themselves. Unions have created spoiled children.
Sometimes, politics is pure comedy. We had an election. One party lost. In a snit, they took their ball and ran home. Now they have the utter gall to cry how unfairly the Reps have acted in using a legal procedure to pass a bill. It would be funny if it weren’t for the fact that the Dems basically used the same hardball tactics in D.C. to pass the monstrosity known as health care. It’s never failed to amaze me how the left feels it’s ok for them to do whatever it takes and makes sure to stick in the face of the opposition and the electorate, but whines and cries the moment they are beaten at their own game. I don’t Think Walker is in as much deep doo doo as one would think. If the Reps are smart, they use their own words and actions against those clowns.
BTW: To listen to these bozos cry about losing pay and what not when they refused to perform the job they were being paid to do might very well be the height of hypocrisy. if nothing else, it shows one just how much the left in fact holds the electorate and any opposition in deep disdain! The fact they can brazenly look at someone and claim they are the victims, not the ones subverting the Democratic process is indeed comedy of the highest degree. too bad it’s so disgusting
The AWOL legislators are fortunate that the Wisconsin House did not initiate impeachment proceedings against them. Dereliction of duty is disgraceful.
Life is very hard when you are stupid. If you are not home to tend the fires, who can you blame if the house burns down. My bet is Walker and the Republicans.
What just happened?
Democrats lost the automatic, often coerced fundraising from unions whose workers were non-police, non-fire PUBLIC employees in Wisconsin.
This is a big loss for Obama and Wisconsin democrats.
Double and triple dipping dem fund raising from each union member is over!
The union can still give, but only from members who allow it.
The medical trust will be edged out, so the dems lose that double dip.
Then the individual members can give, also of their own free will, directly to either party.
Dems are furious about this.
The children are not even in the picture.
Paychecks? For what? Legislators are sounding very much like unions when they expect to be paid for doing nothing.
It is just so funny to watch….especially when Obama and the democrats did exactly the same thing. Obama said “I won” Well Walker Won this election, and he won by saying what he was going to do.
They extorted our paychecks, just because we were out of state and not working, Outrageous!
Extortion: An interesting term that might have repercussions in a civil court.
All I can say is if the Police refuse to keep order and deal with the protestors then the governor needs to call out the national guard and tell the police to go home or be suspended.
What Republicans did was an affront to democracy. Never shall a voter doubt which party stands for the working class, and which for the rich
Hmmm. Let’s see here. They are public sector employees whose salaries are mostly paid for by the tax paying public. That means bydefault the “rich” people they are referring to are private sector tax payers most of whom probably make less money than they do.
So now we are going to have mob rule in Wisconsin?
The most recent news is that the mob has occupied the State House in force, and is issuing threats to the entire staff of overt violence unless the Republicans relent and accede to the Union ultimatum.
This is Democracy, Democrat style. Do it our way or we will beat the C*** out of you and get what we want anyway. Union goons have been brought in by the busload. It is Chicago-style politics.
The election of Gov. Walker is now declared to be fraudulent, as Gov. Walker does not go along with the Union.
How’s that again?
We have Union Rule?
When did that happen?
And the local cops will do nothing about the mob, since the cops are in “solidarity” with the mob.
Make no mistake. The mask is off. It is raw political power: Unions collect mandatory fees, spend those fees to elect Democrats, and the Democrats in turn continue Union control.
It is an oligopoly of the most corrupt kind.
Stay tuned. The ugliness has just begun.
So Republicans actually produced the backbone necessary to WIN this thing??? Excuse me if I wait to see ALL the results posted before I begin cheering. Republicans have a habit of folding, pussing-out and snatching defeat from the jaws of victory even though voters are firmly behind them. So I’ll stick around for a day or two to make sure they haven’t done that here as well. Anyhow, three cheers for Walker and the Republican senate—if they do indeed deserve them.
Deaththreats? What stinkin death threats are you alluding to Mathman? Oh you mean stuff like this? Whoopsies…..
Such peaceful protests….
Have you noticed that the democrats always refer to the USA as a democracy? There’s a planned reason for that. If they called it a republic it would remind us of republicans, and they don’t want that.
I can’t imagine open-minded democrats staying democrats very long. I see the party having fewer and fewer members as time goes on. I can also hear them saying the same thing Ronald Reagan said when he was asked if he had any regrets. He said, “Well, that I was ever a democrat.”
Eventually, the only democrats that will be left will be the Federal employees, the welfare recipients, the politicians, and the ones who want to change our government away from a republic type of rule.
Add Idaho to the list of states moving to end the free lunch fun of public employee unions. On the same day Wisconsin ended many collective bargaining rights of government workers there, Idaho officials moved to limit the process and phase out tenure for unionized teachers.
“Through this plan, we are going to attract and retain more quality teachers in Idaho by offering a two-year contract, increased pay and the opportunity to earn bonuses,” Republican state Rep. Bob Nonini
Read more at the Washington Examiner
DrJohn #7
“When waitresses and fast food workers and the other little people….”
There is no such thing as “Little people,” except the ones who actually call themselves little people. I am a retired truck driver and depended on those “little people” every day. Most of the full-time waitresses and waiters are doing it because they actually like it, and the good ones are making good money doing what they like to do.
Fleebaggers use Nazi tactics. Nazi collaborater Soros has money in this and the Koch Bros. are projected as evil.
As an aside, Idaho got rid of collective bargaining for state employees this past weekend. I read this on Free America. Idaho has balls.
No pun intended on the word collective.
As oldpuppymax points out, the Republicans finally showed some spine. Noe we see what happens next. If the Reps stay on their hind legs and fight with the same tactics as used by the left, truth should win out! It’s going to be quite interesting and if continued successful, a lesson for the scum Rhinos in D.C.
Such civility from the Progressive Socialist Democrats and their union goons – http://www.620wtmj.com/shows/charliesykes/117726263.html
Threatening to kill legislators and their familes. Whomever is behind that email, I really hope the sword of justice cleaves all of you atwain.
In watching this entire episode play out (from the beginning)… Walker really messed up by not making this move first. He left it out there to fester and erode public confidence in his leadership. Walker won election and the Republican took control of the state. Instead of consolidating their position they shot themselves in the foot.
The 2012 election will be close in electoral votes… Obama needs to win Wisconsin’s electoral votes, now for sure he will. So politically bad move for Republicans.
@blast: How do you figure he left it out there to fester, he’s only been in office not even 2 months when he started pushing this. And Obama is a cancer on the American way of life. As are most libtards.
@Duane
If he had pushed the bill that was voted on yesterday, two weeks back instead… there would not have been all of the activity at the Capitol and all of the drama. It would have been done and over before it started. Instead he created a monster that will bite him and his party in the ass.
As to “libards” being a cancer… well I think any ideology that is not flexible has cancerous elements. It says somehow “they” are always right and want to dominate and enforce their agenda. Factions by their nature have the ability to be destructive to democracy. Our founding fathers warned as much in the Federalist Papers.
@Mr. Irons says:
I agree with Gregg. This is my point on how much a strategic mistake it was to prolong and even have this fight. That 50% of Union members that went Republican will vote in great numbers for Democratic candidates the next election. It is kitchen table politics 101. If the electorate is closely split, this will be enough to tilt the state.
This is going to be interesting to watch unfold. Win this battle and loose the Presidential election in 2012… lol. That would be funny as hell.
@blast: couldn’t vote on it 2 weeks back because all the pussy dems left the state.
@blast: Our founding fathers left us a Republic, not a democracy. Ruled by law, not mob rule as in a democracy.
@Duane says:
Yes, that is correct. We are a Republic, but in the context of my comment about factions… they are destructive to democracy = true. See federalist #10.
@Duane
Yeah, they left the state. It was actually ended up being a great tactic for them to delay the process and cause untolled political damage on Walker. Walker should have cut the monetary issues from the bill and voted the union stuff at that point, but he ‘dithered’ for two weeks. So much for political strategy. I actually could care less either way… I have said that in other comments, I am not pro union or against them.
In general I think balance is good in any system. I don’t think conservatives are cancer and I don’t think liberals are cancer… I think big money in elections is cancer. I think corporate personhood is cancer. I think too big to fail banks are cancer.
Our elections now are all about “driving someones negatives up” and not really issue driven. All smoke and mirrors and perceptions. Both parties drove this economy into the ditch, both are subjects of big money.
As I understand it, the WI constitution only requires a quorum for financial issues… So the senate should pass a law that says any member absent for x number of days without good cause is deemed to have resigned. Then Walker can appoint replacements, or simply wait for replacements from special elections.
@blast:
Hmm, so you have no issues at all that Unions which under chartered laws are also deemed Corporations (Non-Profits but still Corporations) in of themselves should somehow be allowed to donate equal or more dollars to Politicians in elections than other businesses? I’m just curious how you define, “big money” given in how the Leftist think groups slam the concept of Koch, Industries donating about 43,000 to Walker but in turn of face WI Union chapters donate a few hundred thousand to Democrats.
As for Banks too big to fail, well under traditional Bankruptcy laws the various banks that were “too big to fail” would naturally have been given economic chemo.
Once they’ve totally killed off the last traces of American workers’ rights and collective bargaining, your New Republican Overlords will finally have you exactly where they want you: in direct competition with overseas labor that will happily do your job for a $100 pay check, 10-12 hours per day, 6 days per week. Lots of luck when that point is finally reached. If you’re working middle class you’ll be up the creek. If you’re a small business owner doing anything other than servicing larger businesses you’ll also be up the creek, because your former customers won’t have the money to buy your goods or services. The vast majority will all be locked into a state of servitude to large multi-national corporations with no allegiance to anything but the dollar–or whatever replaces it–and to the wealthy and powerful who own and operate them. What possible interest would they have in the well-being of the common man? The common man will be nothing but a disposable resource, valued only to the extent that some profit can be extracted from his use. The perfect capitalist dystopia. We get there in a series of steps, lured along by the illusion that we’re actually going somewhere else.
OMG… the dramatic hyperbole. Entertaining, if not fiction in it’s content, Greg. Private unions have been on the decline for quite some time now. Why? Because it is their contracts that are making busines uncompetitive.
Now you want to dig up this drama for public sector workers… which, of course, has no bearing on outsourcing or global competition because of the nature of their jobs for government. duh…. Embarrassing, dude. You just don’t quit, do ya?
Blast, I hate to break this to you but you can not assume that the half of the Union members who voted Republican somehow feel Alienated. I’ve been reviewing the various political platforms these Senators ran on and have browsed for Town Hall meetings of the various Republicans up for recall and examined their voter win margins. Some are in a few districts that may slant more towards blue, but so far they are operating as they had PROMISED to their voter district on plans already told to the WI community. As for Walker, again, what he is doing was already discussed in the political arena within WI. It is amusing that the Mainstream National News is making it sound like the Republicans are just suddenly swinging a hard right handed hook. Voters expressed their voice in the Election cycle of 2010 as per to the Republic, and the Republicans are doing the jobs they were voted to do.
Greg, I also hate to break this to you but if you actual read the provisions passed it only voids current contracts rewarded and has a new set of Contract dates coming up for labor discussions. Collective Bargaining has been reset, not scrapped, with Right To Work laws placed into the bill granting workers the choice to voluntarily join a Union chapter or not. If that is somehow negative in your eyes, I’m sorry. But the bill’s provisions do not utterly break the Union, it forces them back to the bartering table while also giving workers the choice to join or refuse to join a union while still staying employed.
@Mr. Irons, I would totally be in favor of outlawing union money going into political campaigns, if corporate money was out as well. No problem.
Well, we have seen what too big to fail caused in the past few years. Lehman Brothers for instance was apparently too big to fail, because when they did fail… it seized the credit markets and caused major declines in the equity markets as well. It took the US government to stabilize a broken system, and of course we never fixed the system after the fact.
@MataHarley, #39:
The growth of the unionized workforce corresponded with the rapid expansion and economic betterment of the entire American middle class. The decline of organized labor has corresponded with exactly the opposite. The American dream is about the middle class, and about what the vast majority of Americans aspire to. It’s not about the wealthiest 5 percent.
That’s a convenient narrow view, ain’t it Greg. Only two elements in that trend? sigh….
THe decline of organized labor has corresponded with the increase of outsourcing. oops….
No, the American dream is not “about” middle class. It is about being what you choose to be, and having the opportunity to do so. Nothing holds anyone in “middle” or “low” classes.. since you think in classes… save themselves, not taking advantage of our opportunities. But then, your “America” is a bizarre vision at best.
@Mr. Irons
I can bet the majority of them now feel alienated. Just look at the polling in general. Down the tubes for the Republicans. I could care less either way, just more theater for me. We will see sooner than later I suppose.
Blast, a few FA members have already gone over that Polling data over the whole WI event can not be trusted nor relied upon for the formation of opinion of what will happen in 2012 due to faulty sample data gatherings and utterly skewered demographics of political party breakdown among voters.
Yes, you’re right about Lehman, but what political party really shoved though TARP in first formation and aggressively shoved though its second rendition in the Senate and which key Senator aggressively advocated the use of it for the likes of LB and the like? Think hard, it didn’t start with an R for the first part of that question. But under original bankruptcy laws, Lehman would have had majority of its worker base that was responsible of pushing forward such hookey loan policies forward in face of warning of serious losses be terminated and the company folded into the market for rival businesses to either purchase for ownership of various surviving products or spawn the formation of splinter businesses that are smaller in nature giving focused product lines to clients while dealing with smaller operational budgets (AKA can’t take risky gambits like Lehman). Instead we have a Senate, a RINO action from one President, and the aggressive nudge/shove of a Democrat party to give out these rewards to the very businesses that caused the collapse. It took a second form of TARP to get Senate Republicans to remotely budge to pass TARP.
Anyone notice how the lefties are ignoring that even this compromise was rejected by the dems? Yet the Republicans are the ones who took an absolutist stance?
This is really a mild win in my eyes, but the lockstep behavior and livid reaction of the left would have you think otherwise.
@Greg:
I’ve ran the numbers in a previous thread, Greg. Must we do so again? Just saying that one represents a wide group does not make it so, particularly when that one is such a small minority of the overall workforce, and continues to enjoy wages and benefits that most of the workforce is paying for, and would be threatened to pay even more to them were the D’s still in charge.
“MADISON, Wis., March 12 (Reuters) – Up to 100,000 people protested at the Wisconsin state Capitol on Saturday against a new law curbing the union rights of public workers that is seen as one of the biggest challenges in decades facing U.S. organized labor.
“Madison police spokesman Joel DeSpain estimated the crowd at 85,000 to 100,000 people, which would top the size of protests in Madison during the Vietnam War…”
Here’s a video.
A convoy of Wisconsin farmers arrive with their farm equipment in a show of support.
Still more Wisconsin farmers.
This isn’t a crowd of 100,000 “union thugs”, folks. It’s a cross section of highly motivated Wisconsin voters.
Walker and Wisconsin republicans have made a political miscalculation of epic proportion, that’s going to have both state and national consequences.
The union thugs sent out letters to all and any supporters of Walker.
They gave them 6 days to drop their support of Walker or face boycotts, strikes and general ruination.
I wonder if the agra-businesses sent trackers as a way to avert boycotts of their produce?
No way to know.
One big bank only used 1 day of the 6 given to tell the unions to go ahead with their best shots.
The bank was not going to take sides one way or the other.
I think farms are in far more precarious positions financially, however.
One general boycott could be enough to put them under.
@Greg
It’s hardly surprising that when the issue is about the government, either federal or state, not having enough money due to outrageous spending, that you worry more about the possible political points Democrats can garner. That just shows me what I’ve always known about you. Your a socialist swine at heart, yearning to feed from the trough of the public taxpayer, and that you care more about your “side” winning than in doing what is right.
Nothing you’ve argue has in any way been correct on this issue, yet you still parrot HuffPo and the DailyKos, and their lunatic ideas here.
@johngalt, #48:
That crowd of “at least 100,000 protestors” (per Fox News) is almost entirely composed of middle-class public taxpayers–who are also voters.
Farmers who are sufficiently motivated to drive their farm equipment through miles of cold weather into the state capital to protest what their elected officials have done are probably more than sufficiently motivated to turn up at the polls. Farmers generally don’t do such a thing in support of “union thugs”.
Some of you folks might be in serious danger of sustaining whiplash injuries when you finally snap back to reality.
@Greg:
Again, it is as I said. You are more interested in the machinations of the political world, and what it means for the Democrats, than doing what is right and just for the people of WI. It is unfortunate that too many voters remain ignorant, and instead believe the lies, half-truths, and outright fables from the left.
Even so, when the truth finally does come out, those people who actually use their brains for thinking and reason will see that Gov. Walker had no choice to do as he has done, for if he didn’t, WI would end up as bad financial wise as Illinois, California and NY.
@Greg:
Good grief Greg, do you happen to have any idea how many farmers the “Dairy State” has? did you know that Wisconsin has 5.5 million people? Appears that quite a few Wisconsinites stayed the hell away from Madison including the majority of Wisconsin’s farmers!
Also, don’t go worrying about those farmers driving their tractors miles and miles in the cold and btw, just so you know, those tractors with the cabs?….they have heat.
Apparently you have never been down by the Capital in Madison or driven the multi-lane interstate to get to the streets and avenues that take you to it. Those tractors were trailored, no way they legally would be allowed to drive them into Madison. The tractor trailors that hauled them in were probably parked by the union’s busses.
The area is very compact, the streets are narrow, it’s hard to believe they managed to fit that many people down there. It’s no where near the area that was filled by Beck’s 9/12 DC rally where the lefty press would only claim that 87,000 attended.
Here you go, the building with the dome is the Capital:
http://www.cityofmadison.com/
Yeah, I could just see a tractor convoy making it’s way through all that, uh, huh!
http://www.worldfromtheweb.com/Parks/Madison/Madison.html
Even though this site is using 2000 population figures I doubt population in the metro area would be drastically different today, btw, that figure does not include all those college students that live a few blocks away. Considering that Madison is also known as “Little Berkeley” they really should have had more
corporation hatersprotesters, imho.@Greg:
On farmers and farm equipment:
The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel has an update about the tractor driver who on Sunday circled the Wisconsin capitol hauling a manure spreader:
He is in deep doo doo: