About a month ago I put up a post
Candidate Obama would demand impeachment of President Obama
In it I argued that Libya was in middle of a civil war and I did not and do not feel we have any business being involved in a civil war especially since was no direct threat to the United States. I noted that not once has Obama honestly described the situation in Libya. Like him or not, Moammar Gaddafi is/was facing an armed insurrection. Obama has referred to the rebels repeatedly as “peaceful protesters” when in fact they are armed revolutionaries.
Yesterday comes more evidence that Barack Obama lied through his teeth about the reason for our involvement.
EVIDENCE IS now in that President Barack Obama grossly exaggerated the humanitarian threat to justify military action in Libya. The president claimed that intervention was necessary to prevent a “bloodbath’’ in Benghazi, Libya’s second-largest city and last rebel stronghold.
But Human Rights Watch has released data on Misurata, the next-biggest city in Libya and scene of protracted fighting, revealing that Moammar Khadafy is not deliberately massacring civilians but rather narrowly targeting the armed rebels who fight against his government.
We haven’t removed Gaddafi and Gaddafi has retaken several cities and has not engaged in any genocide while he has put down the rebellion. It also turns out that Obama lied about misrepresented Gaddafi’s words when he said
For decades, he has demonstrated a willingness to use brute force through his sponsorship of terrorism against the American people as well as others, and through the killings that he has carried out within his own borders. And just yesterday, speaking of the city of Benghazi — a city of roughly 700,000 people — he threatened, and I quote: “We will have no mercy and no pity” — no mercy on his own citizens.
The truth?
Nor did Khadafy ever threaten civilian massacre in Benghazi, as Obama alleged. The “no mercy’’ warning, of March 17, targeted rebels only, as reported by The New York Times, which noted that Libya’s leader promised amnesty for those “who throw their weapons away.’’ Khadafy even offered the rebels an escape route and open border to Egypt, to avoid a fight “to the bitter end.’’
There is the strong possibility that our involvement has led to more lives lost than would have happened otherwise. Kuperman notes that had Obama and allies not intervened, the conflict would most likely already have ended.
The best evidence that Khadafy did not plan genocide in Benghazi is that he did not perpetrate it in the other cities he had recaptured either fully or partially — including Zawiya, Misurata, and Ajdabiya, which together have a population greater than Benghazi.
There’s your Obama Doctrine. Misrepresent the situation and prolong the suffering. Exactly what has been achieved?
As someone once said, I don’t oppose all wars. What I am opposed to is a dumb war. This is a dumb war and Obama lied us into it. It’s not going to win us more friends.
You have to be an idiot……well, you know the rest by now.
H/T Instpaundit
DrJohn has been a health care professional for more than 30 years. In addition to clinical practice he has done extensive research and has published widely with over 70 original articles and abstracts in the peer-reviewed literature. DrJohn is well known in his field and has lectured on every continent except for Antarctica. He has been married to the same wonderful lady for over 30 years and has three kids- two sons, both of whom are attorneys and one daughter on her way into the field of education.
DrJohn was brought up with the concept that one can do well if one is prepared to work hard but nothing in life is guaranteed.
Except for liberals being foolish.
Obama painted himself into a corner.
He would go to was IF…..
1. there was a broad coalition.
2. someone else took the lead.
3. we had no interests at stake.
Well, Italy was being threatened (and by extension all of Europe) with millions of dark, Muslim refugees.
Gaddafi had held them back, even killing some to keep the numbers down.
Gaddafi had promised the floodgates of refugees would open IF he lost control of Libya.
Also, Europe gets a lot of oil from Gaddafi.
So, broad coalition building was in the works.
Heck, France and the UK were even willing to take the lead!
Then unexpectedly (as Obama always says about high unemployment numbers) the Arab coalition also sought intervention.
Admittedly, these Muslims thought a ”no-fly zone” would be just that.
No civilians (read: fellow Muslims) would be targeted.
Our planes would simply be nice targets for Gaddafi to aim his anti-aircraft guns at.
Now Obama had a HUGE international coalition wanting intervention in Libya.
Finally, the media went all-out to show how little children were being slaughtered by Gaddafi’s men.
Just today a story broke about how Gaddafi uses teenage boys, uninformed about anything, thinking they are going to a practice, only to be fired upon by Gaddafi’s own men IF they try to retreat.
How could Obama do anything other than get involved.
All his weird, anti-American criteria had been reached.
heh.
Now, how will it end?
Dr. John You say “Gaddafi like him or not” Who likes him? You continue to be his defender.You say he has “not engaged in genocide” Who believes that? Are you blind to what’s happening in Misrata? A real misunderstood sweeheart this madman who has killed American civilians at Lockerbie and soldiers in Germany.
The Huffpo has an article whose (misguided) title is:
Arizona Birther Bill Is Unconstitutional, Legal Scholars Say
Dated: 04-15-2011
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/04/15/arizona-birthers-bill-is-unconstitutional_n_849871.html
——————————————————————————————————-
However …. (sorry “Legal Scholars”) …
From Wikipedia:
(Peace_and_Freedom_Party)
The PFP’s first national convention to nominate candidates for President and Vice President was held in Ann Arbor, Michigan on August 17-August 18, 1968. Eldridge Cleaver was nominated for President over Richard C. “Dick” Gregory by a margin of 161.5 to 54. Cleaver, a convicted felon and Black Panther spokesman, was technically not eligible to run since he was only 34 years old at the time. Due to the needs of the state parties to collect signatures, the party fielded several different vice presidential nominees, including Chicago activist Peggy Terry, activist Rodolfo “Corky” Gonzales, radical economist
Doug Dowd, and Judith Mage, who had been nominated at the national convention. Cleaver personally preferred Yippie leader Jerry Rubin. Gregory formed a competing Freedom and Peace party and ran separately. Two states (California and Utah) refused to list Cleaver on the ballot, although each state listed the Presidential Electors and candidates for Vice President (Terry in California and Gonzales in Utah).
From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peace_and_Freedom_Party.
Conclusion:
States DO HAVE THE RIGHT AND POWER TO REMOVE OR DENY PLACEMENT ON BALLOTS IN THEIR RESPECTIVE STATES.
It’s interesting to see how all of Obama’s minions are scattering and fluttering around like chickens with their heads cut off, worried about the effect of Arizona’s law. Why? Is it that Obama really doesn’t have a long-form birth certificate? I guess not. Because why else would Obama’s followers even worry? Obama has a birth certificate. Right? Or, NOT.
If Obama does not qualify by refusing to send his long-form birth certificate to Arizona, then what does that say to the American public about who he really is, or isn’t? There are at least 13 states also considering a law in their states similar to Arizona’s law (that is supportive of and upholds the Constitution of the United States); perhaps there will be at least 7 or more passed. Obama perhaps thinks he can do without those states; and with what people will think is the reason he does not send in his birth certificate.
@rich wheeler: Rich, don’t you wonder why Obama didn’t make that argument? Or are you saying that end justifies the means?
@rich wheeler: Might the fact that Obama approved Megrahi’s release be a problem for Obama?
Do you imagine that Megrahi’s release being all about oil could be a problem for Obama?
My point is that it has ALL been lies. All of it.
Yes, Obama lied, people died.
And what are the treasonous Republicans going to do about this illegal war?
Nothing. As with all major issues facing the Republic, the Republicans are backing the Obama Administration.
The knife in the front is preferable to the knife in in the back.
Yvan, don’t redistribute the blame to REPUBLICANS, IT DOESN’T MAKE YOU LOOK GOOD,
OBAMA IS TO BE BLAME SOLELY, BECAUSE HE WENT ALONE WITHOUT THE CONGRESS ,
and that alone is telling you what he think, and what he can do because he think that he can decide anything he wish for all by himself.
Yesterday, the liar in chief stated he had to do the Libya thing to “prevent massive human slaughter” Now can someone please tell me what the hell is going on over there if it isn’t human slaughter? What am I missing? It’s not slaughter if we and our allies are doing the killing for what cause?
As for the “lied us into war” thing? Duh!! Moron Alert! Any politician in this age of corruptness is a lying sack of you know what! The only funny thing about any of this is that there are actually people out there who choose to believe someone who from his earliest days has been shown to be right up there with the best of them as to lies and deceit. Or as I say, a typical Anti-American Marxist/Socialist wanna be dictator who has learned his lessons well as to tell the big lie!
The Middle Eastern proverb, “The enemy of my enemy is my friend” is hard to apply to this misadventure in war gaming. A very expensive misadventure with a down payment of 200 Cruise missiles at 1.4 million a pop, but that is the least of the bill to be paid. The interest that will be exacted is the enemy now has the knowledge to defeat a “No-Fly” strategy; for while it is an excellent training exercise, we are also training our enemies. I don’t think our training exercises were worth the the expertise the enemy has gained. The long term effects of this war game is also impossible to predict, WW 1 started with the assassination of an obscure duke in the Balkans; we should be familiar with history when tempting fate at a time when the world is poised for war and our leaders seem ignorant of history.
Obama has also made a mistake in revealing himself to be a weak and uncommitted war president; unfortunately, a result of such actions is our enemies are encouraged to take ever bolder and more devious strikes against America, Americans, and American interests abroad. The threat of a ditherer searching for that elusive consensus is so much less intimidating than the Big Stick Diplomacy of a T. Roosevelt. Not that the Big Stick idea is needed or that it will work in this political climate, it just serves to illustrate the extreme polar opposite of the Obama strategy.
Of course, if GaDaffy stays in power he will continue to thumb his nose at the US and NATO and be a perpetual thorn that increases the price of oil on the world and causing dissension in the Middle East and the world. Obama is in a difficult position now. If we send in troops it may become a drawn out war that will cost many American lives and at what gain: to give an oil rich country to Al Qaeda, so that they can buy the best weaponry and finance wars until it becomes the Armageddon.
Dr John There is absolutely NO PROOF that the Obama admin. requested or supported the release of the Lockerbie bomber. Your continued support of THE MAD COL. OVER YOUR COUNTRY’S POTUS borders on treasonous and imho negates much of your continuous personal and hate filled attacks on BHO.
Semper Fi RJW
@rich wheeler: OK, Rich, since you appear disinclined to follow links, here ya go.
@ Ivan… Treason?… Go make a Citizens Arrest or Try. (Your typical half Cocked posting)
Go Here for the definition. Then be prepared for further ridicule here. Your usual tripe defines You.
Do some homework but don’t fall off Your Soapbox. If You were not such a pitiful character You might be taken seriously. You are such an angry little man but not to be be taken seriously.
CHAPTER 115—TREASON, SEDITION, AND SUBVERSIVE ACTIVITIES
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18/usc_sup_01_18_10_I_20_115.html
Get after it Skippy!
Dr John Suggest the real culprits in medical release were United Kingdom doctors who said the bomber would be dead from prostate cancer in a very short time.
Your defense and support of Gaddafi truly defies logic.
OT2 RE DR JOHN. What would you call supporting and defending a genocidal dictator we and our allies are seeking to remove. Water it down if you like. It’s wrong and you know it. How can one condone it?
@rich wheeler: I take it then that the support a whole bunch of Democrats gave to Saddam was borderline treasonous as well and constituted personal and hate filled attacks on Bush? I still support getting rid of Ghaddafi, as in killing him, if it is proven he had anything to do with Lockerbie. This has now been going on for over a month and to the best of my knowledge no one has come out and made the case. If there is evidence, then POTUS needs to state so in a very public way, tell the people that we are going to take him out because of what he did, and then finish the job. If not, we are just spinning our wheels in another country’s civil war. Either way, the military personnel involved have 100% of my support in their mission.
Another Vet Do you doubt Gadaffi was behind Lockerbie? C’MON
Damn right I believe support given Saddam during wartime could be treasonous.When one is filled with personal hatred toward the POTUS his rational judgements are damaged.
another vet, hi, I don’t think It is the AMERICAN WAY TO GO AND KILL GADHAFI,
THE AMERICAN MILITARY, DON’T KILL THE ENNEMIES IN AFGHANISTAN’S WAR,
THEY PUT THEM IN THE PRISON JUST LIKE GANTAMINO, FOR A WHILE
they take good care of them, feed , medical, clothes cleaned get them back in shape; and after a while they receive the order to let them free, even that the prisonners begged to stay in the prison,
so the war goes on, and the WAR GOES ON, and GADAHFI? WELL THEY STILL DEBATING IF THEY
LIKE HIM TO STAY, UNTIL HE GETS TO THE END OF HIS LIFE AND DIE FROM NATURAL CAUSE, OR GET KILLED BY ONE OF HIS REBEL.
@ rich wheeler, The Libyan Civil War is basically a Live Fire Exercise at US Taxpayer Expense and a War for Oil for Great Britain, Italy and France. Not the fact that there is no Congressional Authorization for Our Participation, the Arab League has Veto Power over Target Selection, Sanctions have not limited The Dictators ability to buy arms, the No Fly Zone has not been effective, Serbian Arms dealers shipments still arrive at Libyan Ports, Tens of Tons of Mustard Gas are still in the Dictators control, The Libyan Government Forces are attacking unarmed Civilians at will and there is No Clear Mission or outcome that can be given a timeline.
Tyrants do not deserve support or the leniency that the UN which has no Forces or the Arab League’s ability to dictate terms. Is this Our Fight? Hell no. Despite the US and NATO participants presence a Naval Blockade has not been effective. The No Fly Zone has not been effective. The Colonel’s Forces are still a threat to his Own People and it is a Civil War by clear definition.
Regardless of Rhetoric from the POTUS and Sec of State, it is a Civil War. Period. Where was the intervention in Rwanda a few years back where genocide was rampant? How about Syria or the Sudan?
It is just words and an Un Authorized Live Fire Exercise and shows what happens when there is No US Leadership and Windsock Diplomacy is the prevalent mode.
Currently the AWACS Aircraft are 100% US, the US is Flying roughly 1/3 of the ground support Missions that have had collateral damage on the Civilian Population. It is quite frankly a Cluster F*ck, poorly coordinated and with a 5 Nation Coalition out of a 28 Member NATO roster. Qaddafi is still in power and no predictable end is in sight. Not America’s Fight and not Authorized by Congress. That is my take on it.
Not watered down by any means. Where is Congress on the War Powers Act on this?
I see it as a waste of Time, Resources and Tax Payer Funds. Period.
rich wheeler, I’m sure you are fishing in the wrong waters,
I don’t think you’ll get any fish for your BBQ IN HERE,
IS your water clean enough to fish in your place?
SPEND 50 million to turn TALIBAN, A PEACE PROJECT FOR OBAMA,
I just read that on FOX NEWS.
WHAT? WHO? WHERE? WHEN?
A Little Truth…
Now could this be because the US has a Defense Budget and the rest of NATO does not? Hmmm..
Looks like a US Taxpayer Funded War for Oil to me. Now where is the Outrage?????
OLD TROOPER 2, HI, yes, they are afraid to take any blame, now they want the US to
take that blame, I don’t think they are to be trusted anytime,
that is what I think,
@ilovebeeswarzone: I suppose putting him in GITMO for life would work too. Personally, I’d rather see him suffer the same fate as those who were killed on Pan Am Flight 103. I’m kind of an eye for an eye type when it comes to these things.
another vet, hi, your feeling is legitimate for sure,
bye
@rich wheeler: Unfortunately gut feelings don’t hold up, evidence usually does and sometimes that’s not even enough. People are still claiming, and quite erroneously, that Saddam didn’t have WMD or terrorist ties despite evidence that has come out to the contrary. Hell, we still have morons who believe that Bush brought down the Twin Towers and that we fired a missile into the Pentagon (won’t get into the moon landing being a hoax!). It has been 23 years since Lockerbie, surely we have evidence by now one way or the other. I f it exists, POTUS needs to take the bull by the horns, state the case, and finish the job.
Old Trooper 2 says: 13
Are you going to run away again, Drama queen?
I meant treasonous to the political philosophy. But, one may make the argument that they have failed to live up to their oath to do their job as congressmen and women.
I notice you’re okay with the silence from the Republican House. Nope, you’ll rip Obama day in and day out-which he deserves-yet narry a word from the fools in the House which sell your children and grand-children into economic servitude as they will fail to pay off the interest and debt.
Oh, check that. You won’t have grandchildren.
Take care.
@ Ivan, Your Drama/Delusion continues. You are still living in Your separate reality.
I am a member of No Political Party so save Your empty threats and Propaganda. I don’t know what You are chasing but be careful what You ask for. Exchanging insults with Me here is a waste of Curt’s bandwidth.
Responding to them is a waste of My time. You are just an angry Little Man with no real point to make.
Go Make Your Citizens Arrest, Skippy. Get after those fictional Traitors!
Old Trooper 2 says: 28
@ Ivan, Your Drama/Delusion continues. You are still living in Your separate reality.
Oh really? No wonder the Republican party is in such horrid shape. Conservatives like yourself have been marginalized by leaving the party. Thus, you have no right to complain about Rinos.
Thank you for confessing this.
What are you going to do now, cry on me? ;->
You can’t effectively respond since you’re not a true participant in our Republican form of government. In short, you’re part of the problem.
@Ivan:
Where did OT say that? I missed it. I know I’m not very happy with them.
Bachmann assails Obama over Libya
What are you folks doing to us? We are going to spend billions. I got nothing against f35s but we’re buying them left and right. We had to harden vehicles in Afghanistan and provide more troopers. The Brits are on our ass too.
YVAN YOUR THE ONE PART OF THE PROBLEM HERE, BECAUSE YOU ARE NOT WANTED HERE,
YOUR TOO MAD FOR THIS CROWD HERE, AND YOUR BRAIN IS DISTORTED,
WITH NO CHANCE OF RETURN, in other words you are poison for
everyone
I know its a waste of Curts bandwidth to repeat myself but I can’t help it. I have things to do right now, I’m busy and I’m here responding to this A-hole.
Don’t insult a guys daughter Ivan! I know you just hate women, so in my eyes your a loser already. But hear me out! When a guy makes statements like Ivan has, that’s just grounds for a good old fashioned ass kicking where I’m from. Be glad you don’t know me. Hell ivan, anybody who ever made derogatory statements about anyone in my family was crying for real once I was done with them. I don’t have patients for your kind. Curt must be an incredibly pleasant guy to let you post here, because if it were my blob I would delete you. Maybe I’m a little judgmental that way
Some guys are just desperate for attention. Just like my dog.. And I would give my dog way more respect than I would ever give you. In fact its an insult to my dog to compare him to you. My dog is also not a sexist loser, now that I think of it.
As for your ranting against republicans, most of the people here are republicans. I’m not, I am not a member of any established political groups as of yet but I share conservative values with several of them. You just post that garbage to get a rise out of people huh? If you want to continue your desperate cry for attention: Go to media matters and post, I’m sure they will love you for your political statements and most of them have about the same single digit IQ level as you.
Zac, thank you, very well said, I thought I could do better but your ahead by
a long shot,
are you kidding US had to step in to help lybia. Yes it is a civil war! No it will not directly affect the USA! but Gaddafi is a terrible person just like Hussein more or less. US had every reason to get involved as well as its allies. This “Civil War” was completely one sided. If people are hurting and dying is it wrong to help those suffering or to do nothing and say i dont want to be involved. Personally thats what I see is wrong with people. So selfish, living in their own little world. If you cant help call someone who can. If you arent helping or being part of the solution then you are part of the problem. Either lead, follow or get out of the way. “Now, we must all fear evil men. But there is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men.”
@Turnip: How many people in Libya have been killed by Gaddafi? Do you know how many have been killed in the Congo? In Darfur?
Turnip, hi, you cannot talk of AMERICA NOT DOING IT’S SHARE, they are still dying for the compassion’s sake around the world, they have been out in front to reduce evils people since it was created as a UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, NOBODY CAN QUESTIONNED THEIR FOREVER COMMITMENTS IN HELP ABROAD,
the brave men and woman are fighting for the freedom of all, and should be treated with the outmost respect when they come back
bye
@ilovebeeswarzone:
umm dude you seem to have misread what i wrote.
omg let me simplify this, i am in support for USA!!!
i think people like some people who comment here, not all, complain!!!!!
that we shouldnt do this we shouldnt do that!!!
if you arent there if you’re family isnt there and you arent doing anything but complain then you have absolutely no say in the matter and your opinion is all and forever will be that, just an opinion.
i say the US is doing good and gets out of its way to leave its own problems to aid others, thats F’N GREAT!!
Proud to be from a great country such as US!
once again what im saying is
i support in what the USA is doing and the people complaining without doing anything have no right or say in the matter
TURNIP, WELL SAID, sorry if I mis read you at some point,
we are talking the same language,
may GOD KEEP THE REPUBLIC OF THE UNITED STATES
OF THE BEAUTIFULL AMERICA, AND PROTECT THOSE MILITARYS WHO ARE
ON THE FRONT LINE TO PROTECT THE FREE WORLD FROM THE ENNEMIES
BYE
Old TROOPER2
yes now we know how right you where on your 19 also ,
now the end of LIBYA’S WAR has come and we are later in time,OCTOBER 29 2011
you find a LIBYA self destruct, with vigilante groups, still not wanting to lay down their weapon,
was it worth the involvement of so much?
we are seeing the bodys of so many LIBYANS, we are seeing so many people in total fear, we are seeing dangerous weapon have disappear, we are seeing the destruction of many structures and lands being now poison.
is that what it was all about protecting the civilians?
you where absolutly right,
we should not have been involved, now they know, but don’t admit it.