Gotta agree with Jazz Shaw here, this kind of whining by the left about the “inhumane” prison treatment of the treasonous Manning is beyond idiotic, it’s embarrassing. Jazz Shaw spent some with the Military Police while he was in the military, I spent 6 years working the county jails of Los Angeles. We talk from experience:
And I’m here to tell you that some of these self-styled human rights experts and legal analysts have probably been smoking something which the authorities would also frown upon.
What are these “inhumane” conditions for this POS?
At 5:00 a.m. he is woken up (on weekends, he is allowed to sleep until 7:00 a.m.). Under the rules for the confinement facility, he is not allowed to sleep at anytime between 5:00 a.m. and 8:00 p.m. If he attempts to sleep during those hours, he will be made to sit up or stand by the guards.
He is allowed to watch television during the day. The television stations are limited to the basic local stations. His access to the television ranges from 1 to 3 hours on weekdays to 3 to 6 hours on weekends.
He cannot see other inmates from his cell. He can occasionally hear other inmates talk. Due to being a pretrial confinement facility, inmates rarely stay at the facility for any length of time. [But Manning has been held there, in Maximum Custody, and in total solitary confinement except for one hour a day, for five months without trial. And for the two months prior to arriving at Quantico, he was held in Kuwait under similar conditions.] Currently, there are no other inmates near his cell.From 7:00 p.m. to 9:20 p.m., he is given correspondence time. He is given access to a pen and paper. He is allowed to write letters to family, friends, and his attorneys.
Each night, during his correspondence time, he is allowed to take a 15 to 20 minute shower.
On weekends and holidays, he is allowed to have approved visitors see him from 12:00 to 3:00 p.m.
He is allowed to receive letters from those on his approved list and from his legal counsel. If he receives a letter from someone not on his approved list, he must sign a rejection form. The letter is then either returned to the sender or destroyed.
He is allowed to have any combination of up to 15 books or magazines. He must request the book or magazine by name. Once the book or magazine has been reviewed by the literary board at the confinement facility, and approved, he is allowed to have someone on his approved list send it to him. The person sending the book or magazine to him must do so through a publisher or an approved distributor such as Amazon. They are not allowed to mail the book or magazine directly to PFC Manning.
Due to being held on Prevention of Injury (POI) watch:
PFC Manning is held in his cell for approximately 23 hours a day.
The guards are required to check on PFC Manning every five minutes by asking him if he is okay. PFC Manning is required to respond in some affirmative manner. At night, if the guards cannot see PFC Manning clearly, because he has a blanket over his head or is curled up towards the wall, they will wake him in order to ensure he is okay.
He receives each of his meals in his cell.
He is not allowed to have a pillow or sheets. However, he is given access to two blankets and has recently been given a new mattress that has a built-in pillow.
It goes on and on. The horror of only being allowed one hour outside of his cell, the horror of being allowed only one book at a time to read, oh the horror.
Listen, those put on suicide watch in civilian jails are given the same treatment. Those in maximum confinement are given much the same treatment. I mean come on! Only being allowed to watch TV during the day? Only one shower a day? I recall those receiving confinement during my years in the Marine Corps receiving much harsher treatment then this and they sure were not allowed to watch TV for hours on end.
Some liberal idiots are even calling this torture!
This man signed up to become property of the United States military, he gave up some of the constitutional rights when he signed the dotted line, but given all that the treatment described is way to lenient for someone who committed treason against this country.
And honestly, he is in much better conditions then the real heroes serving in Afghanistan and Iraq.
See author page
This traitor to our country deserves so much more than just “solitary confinement”! We keep hearing the word “alleged” about someone who openly bragged of his exploits. Folks, in my book the man needs to be tried and executed for treason pure and simple. It’s time for the whiney meely mouthed liberals out there to get their heads out of their you know whats and put this country first! Inhumane Treatment?! I’ll tell you what’s inhumane! The open hatred put forward towards this country’s basic tenets which in turn leads to the racial and other open hatred as shown mostly by the left and the enemies of this country and in turn manifests itself in things like the violence on our borders, etc. Yes, I am worked up over this and I have always felt anyone who commits treason should get what they deserve. And for you eyes shut libbies out there, the fact is this man committed treason and in his own words has broadcast that fact to the world. LEt him rot in that cell for all I care!
I am told I could lose my job if I look at any of the sites involved in this leak and also be cited as a conspirator. However this guy who actually did the evil deed is crying because he isn’t getting kid glove handling? Oh BTW I do not believe he did it by himself. It is very rare a private has access to the type of information at the security level it took to gain entrance.
He will be tried and probably sent to Leavenworth for the rest of his life. Military trials according to the USMCJ are a lot different than the civil courts. However after saying that perhaps he will be tried in both courts. serves him right.
Perhaps the main point made by the blogpost you cite is that Manning is being held in these conditions without trial. It is not apparent to me that Manning has a right to a speedy trial or whether he has waived that right. Regardless, the sooner we can try him and then hang him, the better. I am hopeful that it will free up some space to accomodate Assange.
GW, apparently the term “speedy” in the military court martial system has a different meaning because of the process. There is an update from Manning’s lawyer from November, and he mentions nothing of the solitary confinement or imprisonment while awaiting the required investigations to be completed. It would seem that even the attorney knows that asking for what would be a bail release would be absurd. ANd apparently, the time frame isn’t unexpected either.
Considering he’s been held in a military prison, my first guess is that the solitary confinement is likely to be for his own safety. I doubt fellow soldiers, even tho also being held, would be welcoming Manning with open arms considering the treasonous nature of his crimes.
As for me? Personally, I don’t care one a bit about his welfare. Since he felt compelled to confess/boast about his exploits to a fellow hacker via emails, he’s not worthy of any empathy from me. All that’s left is the semantics of the process, and what will ultimately be his punishment.
To me, the larger problem remains. Just how is it that such a low grade serviceman had access to this data? Whoever granted that access and authority should be in the solitary cell next door to Manning as an accessory.
Hey, maybe he would be better off with the general population in a prison? How long before he’s be date raped?
To me, the larger problem remains. Just how is it that such a low grade serviceman had access to this data? Whoever granted that access and authority should be in the solitary cell next door to Manning as an accessory.
I still don’t believe that a soldier with the rank of private would have access to all of the data that he allegedly exposed…and that he found channels for it’s release all over the world. something is missing here.
@MataHarley:
How you ask?
Well, according to this report in The Guardian, Manning was one of more than three million with clearance and potential access to the documents in question:
Then there’s this little tidbit…
Remember the Gorelick wall…and how it prevented the sharing of info between agencies? Well, it seems that the wall was torn down and now virtually everyone has access to virtually every piece of information that there is to be seen:
Don’t forget to add this guy, Adrian Lamo, to the mix…
He was aware of Mannings’ actions and did nothing until it was too late:
I’m not surprised when I hear liberals are complaining about traitors like this being treated the way they are. You have to keep in mind which side a liberal is on in today’s society. They used to just want the USA to help all of the other people of the world. Now, they want all the rest of the world to run the USA.
If you look at things like the enemy does, and figure the liberals want the enemy to win, then anything they do is going to be to help destroy the USA, and anyone who helps do that is their hero. The liberals have joined the ranks of our enemies, and they are now working from the inside. They want their heroes put up on pedestals, not put in confinement.
Smorg #9 WOW
To be clear I have no sympathy for this guy and would like to see a speedy trial and conviction.I would expect an insanity defense from any male watching Lady Gaga C.D.’S I also doubt this guy acted alone.
To say liberals “have joined the ranks of our enemies” is extreme and wrong
I also don’t support Assange,who as you know has called for the resignation of Obama.But many Americans like Ron Paul do support his right to release these documents.I DISAGREE but on this there should be free and open debate.
Thanks for the honest reporting of Manning’s real conditions.
Glenn Greenwald (who, if I recall correctly, was the 1st sock puppeteer on the web) only had un-named sources.
And since he’d make up anything to make his case (as proven by his creation of alter egos all over the web) who knows what’s true/false from his story in Salon.
Manning is accorded with more restraint and dignity than anyone in a County jail.
He should be counting his blessings.
It could very well be that there are those in the Obama administration are afraid of what will come out in a trial and they are dithering and using the chain of command to delay the morons trila.
Also I doubt the this piece of low hanging fruit is the only target of an ongoing investigation. It could well be that members of the administration and/or publishers and members of the Main Stream Media are being targeted for grand juries. I don’t doubt that anyone who vists or coresponds with him picks ticks. I feel pretty sure that his lawyers are begging him to hang tough as long as possible. Of course it may be sinking in to him that he is between a rock and a hard place if convicted he runs the risk of being placed in the general population, if he doesn’t co-operate he runs the risk of being placed in the general population.
If he co-operates and gets a deal the best he can hope for is the conitnuation of his current conditions for the rest of his sentence.
I’m just paranoid enough to thing the two most public figures in the Wikileaks saga are the least important and that they continue to exists only by the suferance of those who looking for bigger fish to fry.
There was a time, not so long ago, that Manning and Assange would both have simply dissappeared into the system, the Cold War was vicious and the treatment of POWs of Cold War was resoundingly quiet. Simply they would have been stored somewhere in the middle of the Virginia countryside in a specially constructed block house and the roots of the security fault would have been ripped from them by means necessary. Yes, I do agree that the names are being collected from Manning . . . it is a known symptom of a diseased social group that there are typically more persons involved in a breach of protocal and that eventually when all the name collection is done . . . the heads will begin to roll.
Has Manning actually condemned himself to a fate worse than death? Was there some event in Mannings work area that actually may have contributed to his own self destruction? Does the lapse in the security system of the US of A actually contribute to the conditions that Manning created?
So many questions . . . no compassion . . . for in my own experience I KNOW that security is a PERSONAL commitment, the work conditions are such that should a person decide to commit the act of security compromise there are as many opportunities to do so as the human mind can create. The decision to NOT compromise is a personal one. As anyone who went through the military KNOWS . . . there is . . . “THE DAILY ENEMY”.
This sort of treatment of a person that hasn’t been convicted of a crime should be shocking to all Americans. What he is accused of is simply an accusation, NOT a conviction.
And in any case, denying him simple stuff like blankets, spying on him 23hrs a day, etc. is all beyond the pale that ANYONE should receive, regardless of what they are accused (or convicted of). It’s a well known fact that this sort of isolation causes mental breakdowns.
If you want to execute him, then get on with the trial and take him out to the gallows and get it over with.
@andyinsdca:
Now Andy…would you prefer that Manning be housed along with the general population where he would be at risk for injury or death?
Would you prefer that he be allowed to have blankets, etc so that he could use them to commit suicide?
The CO of the prison facility in which Manning is being held has placed him under detention conditions which will serve to keep him safe until such time as he can be tried for the crimes that he is suspected of, and has admitted to, committing.
Exit Question: How loudly would you squeal if Manning were injured or killed as a result of being placed within reach of the general population?
Don’t liberals realize that there are only so many ten acre English estates available for confinement?
Wow! I wonder sometimes. I just want to make a point here. Yes, I think he should get a trial. Also,Ii do believe that he was not alone in doing this. Having said all of that, there is one known fact here. This clown bragged about what he was doing online for God’s sakes! I personally am sick and tired of the term” alleged”, especially when a piece of scum like this brags about what he has done. I have said more than once: IN THEIR OWN WORDS” when addressing issues like my equating Obama to Socialism as an example.
While I’m on this subject, I am also fed up with the LSM propaganda machine that is looking for any excuse for this guy’s actions (such as the “he was mad because of DADT). Get off it already! This man enlisted and swore his life to his country. He committed treason! In my view, treason should be punishable by the most severe penalty possible. I have and will always feel like this. As my son-in law is at this minute in Afghanistan giving his all for us, this crybaby garbage as to Pvt. Manning does nothing but tick me off even worse!
I’m sorry for those of you out there who feel this is harsh. Reality is harsh folks! And the fact is this guy is a traitor so I really don’t care how he is “being treated”. Lock him away and throw away the key.
For what it’s worth, I feel the same way about Jonathan Pollard. The Israelis and so many others want him released because “he was spying for the good guys”. Bull! While I am proudly of Jewish consent, it doesn’t change my stand as to spying which I equate to treason.
This guy should assume room temperature as soon as possible.
andyinsdca, you are obviously very ignorant of how prison works. Inmates in his position are normally treated that way for the reasons Aye stated. It is hardly cruel and inhumane, but I think you know that. So knock of the hysterical bleating.
@ Tallgrass, #14:
I think we’ve got the very high probability of a YES answer on that one. It’s totally absurd that sensitive and classified information isn’t firewalled to prevent some kid in the office from downloading it onto a CD or keychain memory stick. My theory is that some of the people making routine security decisions are a generation or two behind in their understanding of computer technology.
I can’t believe the access to classified info that a pfc has. As a chemical and engineering officer, one would process classified info but would purposefully remain out of the main info circle. Divulging anything would warrant severe consequences. No paper trail, but a trail nontheless. Military justice should be and is very severe. In my day, it was, and warrants the death penalty during a war. It depends on the security level.
Today, I still remain silent, on info that has been declassified. An oath to secrecy means something.
The bleeding-heart libs can whine all they want to no avail. This oxygen theif is in the miltary juducial system and sooner or later he will be sent to Leavenworth to spend the rest of his worthless life making little rocks out of big rocks. He will be forgotten.
It is ALL about Supervision. Manning WAS very Poorly Supervised. Call it Complacency if you wish but there was negligence involved in his Supervision. Point Blank. More to this will come out in the Court Martial. Rest assured on that.
Just like the “Monkey Business” at Abu Graib, the fault lies ultimately with a Failure in Command, dereliction and negligence. You are in Command, then Everything Your Troops do or fail to do is in your lap. Period.
My Take on that…
@ andyinsdca, quite frankly what You know about the Code of Conduct or the UCMJ would fit very nicely in a gnat’s @ss. Manning KNEW what he was doing and KNEW the consequences. He is in Pre-Trial Confinement for good reasons. Safe and secure. He is NOT a Civilian. He is a Soldier until his Case is Adjudicated under the UCMJ.
You outraged clowns amuse me. Then maybe you don’t… As You can see your ignorance is pretty plain in this matter. Talk about your local weather, your favorite color or what you want for Christmas…OK? Something You may know something about…
OT, I’ve been waiting for you to weigh in on why you believe a low grade soldier has access to this info. You are saying it’s common… which @Aye confirms in his ensuing comment. But that it’s all about “supervision”.
Any thoughts on how to control what a lower level military serviceman has access too, and our national security? Because this strikes me as a HUGE.. and I do mean huge… flaw.
So Rich, may I assume you are not a Lady Gag Gag Fan?
I was a big fan of Smokey Robinson and some of the other Motown sounds, other than that I have primarily been a Country and Western guy, with an appreciation for the old Bluegrass music (from the Thirties); although, the young people tell me that there is no longer any Western music, just like there is no longer a Motown sound and that I sound foolish talking about it. I miss them both, where do you stand on this issue?
I was under the assumption that Manning had a higher rating or pay grade, but was stripped of rank before being thrown in the brig.
From what I heard from former prisoners and chasers (escorts for prisoners to and from trial) Manning has a way better deal than those who served time in a Naval Brig, Way Better.
#28, Skookum, you are correct.
I am also not sure when he lost his specialist ranking but he had one before the arrest.
Skook Love Motown,Smokey,4 Tops,Temptations all still great. Heck I like rock,Bob Seger,Tom Petty,Springsteen.Country listen to Willie and Waylon.Not much use for Gaga and her ilk.The music you love exists and will last forever.
At night I’ll lie in bed and sing along to music from 50’s Dowap and oldies like it was yesterday.My wife who is only 47 pretends to enjoy.Great Fun.
I GREATLY enjoy your stories of the West.Like music you paint a beautiful picture.Thanks
Rich believe it or not, I was once a fair ballroom dancer and usually could win the contests. I can’t tell you how many times I danced with beautiful girls while listening to Tracks of My Tears or drove my motorcycle while singing that same song over and over to myself even though I can’t carry a tune in a bucket, but I will guarantee you I can dance with the best. Oh to be young again.
I loved Jerry Lee’s music and Johnny Cash; Cash was more admired in Europe than the US as strange as that sounds. Surely you remember Charley Pride, there were some great artists back in the day. What happened?
I heard the Righteous Brothers was the first and only White group to play the Apollo and the management was so nervous that they didn’t lift the curtain until they had them dancing in the aisles and calling out that the music was Righteous, hence the name. I don’t know if that story is true , but I think it is and it is a great legend.
The way that Lewis, Cash, and Presley borrowed from the Motown, Rhythm and Blues and Black Blues like Howlin Wolf, Muddy Waters and those sounds has been fascinating for me and revolutionary for the time.
Skooks ‘”Tracks of my tears” Baby,baby,baby take a good look at my face Saw Smokey sing it at The Greek Theater circa 1972.Johnny Rivers does a great version as well
Heard Buddy Holly from Lubbock( fantastic) was first white act at Apollo.Could have been Medley and Hatfield though.I played golf with Bobby in early 80’s.Great guy who died too young.
Muddy Waters, Howlin Wolf influenced Clapton and The Stones.The blues from N.O. and Chicago influenced a generation of British rockers as well as the greats,Presley,Cash, Jerry Lee and don’t forget Chuck Berry.
Bluegrass still great and played here in So.Cal.
Skooks The music will Never D1e Keep dancing as long as your standing.
Semper Fi Good bless our military at Christmas.
.
That’s God blees our troops.It’s 5 0’clock somewhere.Bears/Vikings underway.
@Old Trooper 2: #24
####
My son is a sergeant in the Air Force and at one time it was just him and one officer where he was. I told him that it must be frustrating to be a sergeant and not have anyone under you to boss around. He said that it was great, because if one of those under him would screw up he would have a whole bunch of paperwork to fill out. I can’t argue that.
@Skookum: #27
A long time ago someone told me that Smokey Robinson practiced a lot to sound like he was white. I still don’t care about a person’s outside, I judge people by their inside.
I miss my cowboy music. When I was married, my wife surprised me with a bus trip to Des Moines IA to see the Sons Of The Pioneers sing. I figured they had died off a long time ago. Fortunately, they always found replacements for anyone who dropped off. I really enjoyed the songs and bought the cassette they were selling.
I miss the songs that actually told a story and didn’t use cuss words. I prefer what I call the “feel good” songs where you feel good after the song is over.
I know each generation says this, but I feel sorry for parents raising kids today. It was a lot easier in my time to keep kids away from the things parents didn’t want them to see or hear. The one main desire you have to have today to make it in ANY entertainment field is a desire to help lower the moral standards of the populace. As I have asked before, can anyone name one TV show or movie in the last few years that sex is not EXPECTED on the first date? Is that how you want your kids brought up?
OK FA Troops, snowstorm of the era in Belgium. Nothing flying in or out of Europe so I’m up at 0358 hours here watching these folks struggle with it. We get this kinda snow storms in Montana frequently. No big deal but the EUROs are on Emergency Mode. Cold for them here but very normal in my neck of the woods…
On PVT Manning, He was basically deserving of being Chaptered out of the Army but some incompetent Officers & NCOs left him “on the job”. I would have had him Stateside awaiting Discharge in a New York Minute but he had access, did his damage and the whole deal went down.
In my Units, possession of a “Flash Drive” in a “Sensitive Area” would have been grounds for a Court Martial regardless of what was on it. Burning a CD would have sealed the Deal. Off to the Stockade with no hesitation. In hand irons. Period.
There are Folks with access to Classified Info that passed the Background for Clearance that I would not trust with the Time of Day. My Operations were ALL Classified and any compromise would cost LIVES so I’m kind of a Hard @ss on that. What is worse yet is that Afghanis that cooperated with NATO Forces are now in the breeze…for Folks that bear grudges for a Thousand Years over Tribal issues, waiting a Year for US Forces to withdraw is like a coffee break. They wait and then cave in the Afghan Government when We are gone.
Manning was a problem Soldier and should never have had his Clearance. Point Blank. Are there associates or accomplices? Maybe…Manning was not the sharpest knife in the drawer. He had help to get this accomplished or encouragement from ‘others’ that were not military.
I booted Embeds, Newsies, from my Area of Operations just on suspicion of compromise of what they heard or saw in my locale. I did it without blinking an eye. no questions, no hesitation. Gone on the next thing smoking on the runway at Kandahar.
Manning had poor Supervision. Period. In my book, Case Closed!
There’s my 2 cents worth.
At sometime in the past . . . perhaps when the dinos walked the earth . . . there was a statement concerning enlisted persons . . . something to the effect that “enlisted personnel should never be trusted . . . for they are sly and devious.” Hum, not sure that I agree with this in principal, but I do agree that it does apply in some cases.
As our military has made the transition through time, it has been racially desegregated, gender neutralized, religiously equalized, . . . well is there any social aspect of the military that has not been analyzed, documentized, legitimized, . . . . perhaps resulting in our military being sodomized! Of course if you are a swabby, a grunt, a joe . . . that last word is said in a much more direct and socially repulsive annunciation.
The fact of the matter is simply that the members of the military are continuously subjected to a low level of “demonification” . . . it is not acceptable within a command to be just and outstanding solider, airman, sailor or marine, to be able to peform YOUR job to perfection. No . . . you must be much more than that . . . you must be a “socially conscious” almost religous like dullard and totally disregard all things that YOUR life depends on.
The military has created an entire category of “those who are repressed”. We see it today in the way sexual preference is legislated. This is an example of how the military has been forced to and thus has created a demographic of repressed souls . . . it matters not what a military person is repressed by . . . the cause of the repression can be something as stupid as “being vegan” and forced to observe cooked meat . . . Get it?
Thus, did our ninny Manning develop his “psyop” perspective of revenge. Get it? This idiot felt feelings that were integral to the area where he was stationed . . . Get it? In all probablility it was the VERY SUPERVISION that he was subjected to that contributed to his “attitude” . . . was it the supervisions fault? WTF . . . was Manning set up by a system that has in and of its self been set up. Does Manning deserve OUR empathy? . . . Does the system deserve our animosity?
WTF man . . . I am just very, very, very happy that I do not have to serve with females on SUBMARINES!!!!
Just like in the opening narration to the classic sci fi TV series THE OUTER LIMITS was WE,LL CONTROL ALL YOU SEE AND HEAR and thats the same way under BIG BROTHER OBAMAS and his socialists FCC