Yes Aye, I noticed how the left ignores the how their bretheren in the ACLU and other far left groups fooght against trying them with tribunals. Then they turn around and attack Bush for not doing so. Sleazy hypocrites.

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He was designated an enemy combatant and could have been held as such

Er, no. He was supposedly threatened with that by the FBI but he agreed to assist in the investigation of others and he was never placed under that status.

just like the German sabouteurs . . . one of whom was, if I recall correctly, a US citizen of German heritage.

For the record, all eight of the saboteurs were German born. Two became naturalized citizens. One of those two was given clemency by Truman on condition of deportation in 1948.

You appear to have been asleep the last 64 years, so maybe I should fill you in. Modern day Leftists in America have come to represent nothing more than spineless masses of jelly.

As a whole, they don’t have the cajones, the guts, or the courage to do what needs to be done in the face of a brutal enemy.

They don’t have the wherewithal to take a stand and simply say “Shoot them in the head.”

It appears that their mindset is to do whatever they can to insure that the alligator eats them last.

FDR understood what the stakes were. Hence the saboteur case.

Weren’t considered terrorism by whom? You don’t think buying a gun, staking out a federal building and machine gunning CIA agents is terrorism?

How, precisely, were Kasi’s crimes any different than say Bundy, or Kaczynski, or Gacy, or any of the thousands of other murders which are committed on the streets of America?

That’s right…they weren’t any different. Heinous? Yes. Terrorism? No.

If you have a good faith explanation for the different reactions by conservatives to Islamist terrorists being tried by Bush in federal courts when compared to other Islamists terrorists being tried by Obama in federal courts, I have yet to hear it.

Refer to post #17 for all the things you are looking for.

Remember also that the Leftists in this country had their pretty pink panties in a twist, endlessly whining and crying like six year old girls over how Padilla, Moussoui, et al were treated.

They created tales of woe and scaremongering about how Bush was going to round up people and jail them endlessly and without cause or charge.

Padilla’s fate was ultimately decided the way that it was due to relentless pressure from those opposed to the very tribunals that you seem willing to champion only when convenient.

It should also be pointed out that Obie is not eliminating the tribunal process completely. He’s simply selectively singling out those who he wishes to give show trials to.

He and Holder have both made it clear that even if KSM is acquitted in court, which is a very distinct possibility, he will not be released.

That’s the technique of petty tyrants and tin pot dictators. It’s shameful to think that a US president would take such a position.

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“Which of these things is not like the others?

“Iyman Faris – Naturalized US citizen. Arrested on US soil. Guaranteed constitutional protections. Hands tied.”

Er, no. He was designated an enemy combatant and could have been held as such, just like the German sabouteurs . . . one of whom was, if I recall correctly, a US citizen of German heritage.

“Jose Padilla – Natural born US citizen. Arrested on US soil. Guaranteed constitutional protections. Hands tied.”

Could have been tried by a military commission, too. But he wasn’t.

“Ramzi Yousef – Captured in Pakistan and tried in the US by Clinton’s Justice Dept. Clinton set the precedent because he considered the first WTC attack a “law enforcement” matter. We all know the fruit that approach yielded.”

Yes, we do: Yousef in jail for the rest of his life and no attacks on US soil fo eight years. But the point being — Clinton, like Bush, tried Islamist terrorists in US federal courts.

“Zacc Moussoui – Arrested on US soil for crimes committed on US soil. Guaranteed constitutional protections. Hands tied.”

Why do you think he was “guaranteed Constitutional protections”? He was not a citizen and he could have been held as an enemy combatant, just as Padilla was. In fact, since he was part of the 9/11 plot, there was NO REASON for him to be tried in federal court.

“John Walker Lindh – Natural born US citizen. Captured on the battlefield. Guaranteed constitutional protections. Hands tied.”

I’ll let that one pass. But my point is simple — he was a terrorist and was tried in federal court.

“Mir Amal Kasi – Arrested in Pakistan for crimes committed on US soil. Guaranteed constitutional protections. Hands tied. The murders he committed, while heinous, were not considered to be terrorism.”

Weren’t considered terrorism by whom? You don’t think buying a gun, staking out a federal building and machine gunning CIA agents is terrorism? OK . . . .

My point is simple — KSM was captured in Pakistan for terrorism crimes committed in the US. His murders occurred in Manhattan and a Manhattan jury should judge him.

KSM is not the first terrorist tried in federal court and those prosecutions went pretty friggin well. Your “distinctions” above shed no light on why conservatives gave Bush a pass (never said a word) when he tried al Queda and Taliban members in federal court, but are now crying like babies that you are SO AFRAID of al Queda coming to New York.

I simply do not recall, when Bush was trying Walker Lindh and Padilla and Moussoui and Faris in federal court, any criticism from conservatives about the cost, the media spotlight, the military option, etc. And since Padilla was tried AFTER the Military Commission Act of 2006 was passed, the same argument about “use military commissions” COULD HAVE BEEN made then, too. But conservatives said nothing.

If you have a good faith explanation for the different reactions by conservatives to Islamist terrorists being tried by Bush in federal courts when compared to other Islamists terrorists being tried by Obama in federal courts, I have yet to hear it. The only difference that I can tell? The party of the president trying the terrorists.

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What happened to Faris, Padilla, Ramzi Yusef, Moussoui and Walker Lindh? All were tried in federal court and were convicted or pled guilty. Mir Amal Kasi was tried in state court in Virginia and executed.

Which of these things is not like the others?

Iyman Faris - Naturalized US citizen. Arrested on US soil. Guaranteed constitutional protections. Hands tied.

Jose Padilla – Natural born US citizen. Arrested on US soil. Guaranteed constitutional protections. Hands tied.

Ramzi Yousef – Captured in Pakistan and tried in the US by Clinton’s Justice Dept. Clinton set the precedent because he considered the first WTC attack a “law enforcement” matter. We all know the fruit that approach yielded.

Zacc Moussoui – Arrested on US soil for crimes committed on US soil. Guaranteed constitutional protections. Hands tied.

John Walker Lindh – Natural born US citizen. Captured on the battlefield. Guaranteed constitutional protections. Hands tied.

Mir Amal Kasi – Arrested in Pakistan for crimes committed on US soil. Guaranteed constitutional protections. Hands tied. The murders he committed, while heinous, were not considered to be terrorism.

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@ Madalyn –

If your were KSM, would you want to “walk” and be freed in New York City? I think not . . . .

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“For if we are at war, why is Khalid Sheikh Mohammed headed for trial in federal court in the Southern District of New York?”

KSM is being tried in the SDNY for the same reason his nephew, Ramzi Yousef, was tried in the same court. And the same reason Iyman Faris and Zacc Moussoui and John Walker Lindh were tried in Virginia, and Jose Padilla in Miami.

If Obama trying KSM in Manhattan means we are “not at war” in conservative eyes, then we were not “at war” when Bush tried Faris, Moussoui, Walker Lindh, and Padilla.

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Much silliness from the conservative side on this. Let’s start with the point about KSM being “caught on a battlefield,” as Lindsaye Graham said today. In fact, he wasn’t on a “battlefield.” He was in an apartment in Pakistan. As were his nephew Ramzi Yousef (original WTC bomber) and Mir Amal Kasi, the CIA shooter, when they were caught. Jose Padilla was at O’Hare Airport and Iyman Faris was in his appartment. John Walker Lindh was pretty much on a battlefield, sincce he was in a prison in Afghanistan when he was captured by the US. Zaccarias Moussoui was at a flight training school when he was arrested by the FBI, if I recall correctly.

What happened to Faris, Padilla, Ramzi Yusef, Moussoui and Walker Lindh? All were tried in federal court and were convicted or pled guilty. Mir Amal Kasi was tried in state court in Virginia and executed.

Was George W. Bush setting any precedent by trying al Queda members Faris and Padilla and Moussoui in federal court? Not really, since Clinton had tried other Islamist terrorists in federal court.

Before anyone claims Obama is doing anything remarkable, please explain how trying KSM in Manhattan is substantively different than trying Moussoui and Faris in Virginia, Padilla in Miami, Yousef in Manhattan, and Kasi in state court in Virginia.

Even better — why was there no outcry from conservatives when Bush prosecuted al Queda members in federal court, but now all of a sudden the sky is falling because Obama is doing the same thing?

There is such Chicken Little sentiment among conservatives. Do they just not have any guts, or are they doing this for show, for the ever shrinking base (down to 20% of the voting public, and counting).

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Not knowing anything about the law, can someone let me know the answer to this:
If KSM walks due to a technicality in a Federal trial, can the military then try him? Is that considered double jeopardy? Does Holder or his boss have any idea what a catastrophe they are creating?
Madalyn

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“America” is NOT at war.

“America” is at the mall.

The American MILITARY is at war.

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Good to hear from you again, Colonel.

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