[DELETED BY AUTHOR]
31 Jan
A Mark Steyn Masterpiece on The Stimulus Bill
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Saturday, January 31st, 2009 at 8:41 pm | 5 views
Stats
its not stimulus its bullshit and i don’t want to be fed a crap sandwich. i was looking at some of the prejects, are you kidding me? dog parks? solar water heaters? i can’t believe anyone in good conscience voted for this. this really makes no sense. when your household budget takes a hit you reduce spending, maybe cut back the cable, lose a phine line, watch the lights being left on, clip coupons for food. you don’t run out and ask for money from someone else to build and addition to your house when you can’t even afford your house. totally fucking retarded. it would be nicet o throw all of these dipshits out of washingon and bring in a team of accountants to straighten shit out on the budget, and then go from there.
Just wanted to mention that thousands of people will be left
without electricity in freezing temps for a week or more.
Yet obama does nothing! obama does not care about white people!
Yeah Hard Right, it’s Obama’s fault that Bush’s FEMA hasn’t been completely revamped in a week and a half.
This is just one more Republican mess to dig out of. Instead of dodging blame, Republicans might do better to try to figure out why these states’ electrical grids are in such crappy shape. And I bet these states aren’t the only ones. It seems like we have an electrical infrastructure designed for operating under perfect conditions only.
It doesn’t matter what Obama does. Unless he is removed from the presidency (for uneligibility), Republicans will NEVER win another election.
Obama Retools Campaign Machine
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20090130/pl_afp/uspoliticsinternetobama
EXCERPTS from my prvious link in comment #4
“In a YouTube video as well as an email to the 13 million supporters on his mailing list, the president-elect announced the transformation of “Obama for America” into a new organization, “Organizing for America.”
“You’ve built the largest grass roots movement in history,” Obama told his backers. “And the movement you’ve built is too important to stop growing now.”
“Obama’s already built a fundraising machine that is unparalled,” Graff added. “If he can double it by 2012 there’s not going to be a single person in America who can catch him. ”
“Does anyone think there’s a Republican out there who can raise a billion dollars to run against a sitting president of the United States?”
Speaking of Mark Steyn, has anybody read his latest book “America Alone: The End of the World as We Know It”?
Get this book, it is absolutely fantastic!
Haven’t heard? When the ice storm hit DC, Obama said they had to toughen up, it was nothing like living in Chicago. Then he went back to his office that he keeps “hot enough to grow orchids.” Other than that, I don’t think he is all to concerned about Kentucky, guess he’s depending on that new dem governor to take care of things, they’ve always worked well in the past.
About that std portion Pelosi’s peddling. That had some pretty raunchy stuff in it that was, and I hope it will remain was, included in the sex ed portion of it. They were axing out abstinence ed in favor of sexual identity, teaching high schoolers massage techniques and an assortment of other tawdry acts that doesn’t belong in high schools.
And what happens when we don’t stimulate? What’s that called — Obama is a miserable failure.
The Porkulous bill represented graphically.
Let me just be the first to say, those are some big balls.
h/t – Suitably Flip
Aye: nice graphic, where is the $4,898,681,252,731.51 of debit added by the Bush administration?
Same song. Same verse.
Your pool really is quite shallow.
@Aye Chihuahua: You’d think that if bl ass t cared so much about the debt run up by Bush OVER EIGHT YEARS he would be hopping mad at the “stimulus” debt which Obama ran up IN ONE WEEK that is approximately one quarter of Bush’s entire amount.
Yes, you would think that if bl ass t was really so concerned with the debt and not just a selective trashing of President Bush he would be appalled at the stimulus bill.
But apparently his outrage seems to be only directed at the man who will forever remain a piker by comparison with Obama where debt is concerned.
As I have said before, bl ass t is nothing more than an enabler for the REALLY big spenders.
“Fair and Balanced” can’t you handle the truth? I think Republicans and Bush loyalists have to be reminded constantly of how bad they handled the economy. That is not to let Obama off the hook if he signs a boondoggle of a bill, but to point out the hypocrisy of the so called right wing who supported Bush’s unprecedented deficit spending.
How does it feel to be living in the Bush economy? Housing values dropped historically (30-40%), Equities Markets drop 50%, Credit markets collapse, Huge increases in unemployment… GDP dropping, recession, depression?
Unregulated trade with China, poison food, lead painted toys, depressed Yuan to wipe out American industries as Bush Administration did NOTHING (except borrow more money from China). And much much more.
First, you are incorrect as to what Obama has spent as no bill has been signed into law. Second, the present bill has $275 Billion in tax cuts and around $500 Billion in spending, George Bush & Company passed a $700 Billion Bailout for Wall Street, so in my math, Bush & Company not only Nationalized the world’s largest insurance company, AIG, (using Fed Reserve Funds and TARP), but they requested 200 Billion more than Obama.
Again with the “Bush” “Bush” “Bush”.
I asked you once before what spending you have wanted President Bush to have cut but you remained silent.
Should we have cut the spending for:
Prescription drugs?
Afghanistan?
Iraq?
Katrina?
TARP?
(Those are the really big $ projects that come to mind.)
So, put your toes on the line and answer the question.
What would you have cut if you had been president (Lord help us all) for the last eight years?
You have a remarkable number of fingers and a tremendous shortage of answers.
That’s a great question.
Actually, it feels pretty good to me.
My home value is up by 21%. I just paid the property taxes Jan 15, so that stands out.
My savings and retirement accounts are both up because I watch them closely and do a good job with risk distribution.
My business is up. Earnings are up, and we just added two new people.
So, yeah, it feels pretty good.
Yeah, Bush spent money to appease democrats. The medicare prescription drug thing was something most democrats fought against. And I remember Teddy Kennedy put his own name on the Bush Education bill that increase education spending by double. But democrats are now blaming bush for fixing education and making prescription drugs available to the elderly.
Oh and don’t forget, as Bob Geldoff is fond of saying, Bush has been screwed by the american press because he has done’ more to end aids in Africa than ony other person ever. So yeah, lets rag on him for bowing to liberal causes again and again in spite of the damage to the deficit.
Now how does ragging on Bush excuse democrats for throwing my money into a fan and calling it ‘stimulus’?
Democrats were told that raising the minimum wage would cause massive layoff and unemployment. The Dems did it anyway. In the month following five hundred thousand people lost jobs just as conservatives foretold. But Dems all have fingers in their ears pretending they did not hear the warnings.
Then democrat policies behind the Community Re-investment Act and the way democcrat congesscritters, like Dodd and Frank, kept any warning about the financial crisis that anyone could see coming a mile away. Bush warned of the collaspe and Dems were all; Nuh Uh! Nuthing wrong here with all this uncapitalised debt. And they refused to entertain any idea of Fannie or Freddie failure. Now they refuse to entertain the idea they are responsible.
Why is it that liberals never see themselves as responsible for anything? Sure the Dems have been in charge of Congress for a mere two years. Already they wiped away 2 miilion jobs alone by raising the minimum wage in less than three months after the legislation passed. The promises of ‘cap and trade’ have caused capital to flee the country for countries where job creation is appreciated.
Look at what Pelosi and crew have done to California? Business is leaving for other states.
Now Pelosi and crew want to chase Your job out of Your state too. Yeah, California needs a bail out.
The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other peoples money.
Thank you Reckless.
Very nice.
Another round of “Bush” “Bush” “Bush” and spittle flecked head asplodin’ in 3, 2, 1….
Are you crazy, we argued throughout a thread over Iraq after I did address your question.
Where do you live? Obviously, if that is true, you are in a very select market since most of the rest of the nation is struggling, or do you deny the economic problems?
Oh, tell me about those allocations?
I cannot edit my previous comment. It keeps crawling around in the edit box and I cannot seem to stop the cursor from roaming around. (Windows 7 using IE
But I wanted to add, Obama is eating Waygu steaks ($250.00/lb) while people are freezing to death because Obama’s FEMA is failing to protect anyone.
Maybe if Obama weren’t a racist he would care more about people in need and do something wothwhile other than eat the most expensive meat on the planet a get fat while people are dying.
He has not so much as noticed that 600,000 people are freezing to death while he eats his fancy steaks!
@blast:
Aye Chihuahua: I asked you once before what spending you have wanted President Bush to have cut but you remained silent.
Yes, we argued over Iraq. We determined that you think that brown people should have to “earn” their freedom to live without oppression.
No, you never answered the question. Just like right now.
I live in small town in GA. The home was built in 1880. I’m not sure that is what you would refer to as a “select market” or not but it is what it is.
The housing market is suffering because the credit market is suffering. The credit market is suffering because of poor legislation like the CRA and gov’t tinkering in things like FannieMae and FreddieMac and lawsuits against banks like the one where BO was the attorney acting on behalf of ACORN.
A combination of risk distributions throughout a variety of investments. A close eye on what is going on, and what may go on.
My home value is up. Here in the midwest home prices never became as insanely inflated as both coasts. My home value goes up consistently by about 2 to 3% a year. I have savings. I keep my budget within my earnings. Unlike democrats (i.e California) who don’t understand why, when John F Kennedy cut taxes severely in the early sixties the economy grew until the mid seventies when Jimmuh Cahtah came along and gave Iran to the Mullahs who control it to this day. And Jimmuh was responsible for the Community Re-Investment Act which has bankrupted everyone this last year. But after we had to sit in lines for hours to obtain gas to drive our cars and food prices were through the roof Reagan came in and cut taxes and the economy expanded for the next 20 years.
But the last thing democrats will do is lower taxes. Even though lower taxes creates more jobs and actual tax collections go up when more are working, Democrats are all going, well that is a conservative idea so we cannot do it even if it is the smart thig to do. Because, you know, it would validate the idea that Dems are responsible the current economy stall.
@reckless:
Didn’t George Bush catch hell because he had a piece of birthday cake while Katrina was a’blowin?
The hypocrisy is striking isn’t it?
Oh, the decider actually was the appeaser? Give me a break. That is laughable on its face.
It does not excuse democrats (and Obama) for anything. It does point out the hypocrisy involved in some of the commenters and posters here for railing against Obama for the same things that Bush did and then some. Bush ran up the largest deficit in our nations history during what many here called “good economic” times (prior 2007/8).
Add to that, the Bush TARP bailout was $700 Billion, the present democrat ‘stimulus’ package is $500 Billion in spending (and $250 Billion in tax cuts if you consider that spending).
Give me a break Aye.
Actually I did address the question. I did not address specifics of Katrina or Afghanistan, but general principals (balanced budget). I did address Iraq and prescription drugs specifically.
You derailed the discussion on saying I did not like brown people and did not keep to the actual topic of spending.
If I recall, the President can’t pass any budget or stimulus package without the House and Senate creating and passing a budget. Is that right?
So, who created the stimulus package and sent it to Bush’s desk?
@blast:
Once again you’re obfuscating.
You never answered the question then.
You’re not answering it now.
If you had been in the chair behind the desk in the Oval Office, pen in hand (Lord help us) what would you have vetoed?
I gave you a list of the major $$ projects. Feel free to add to it if you like.
We know that you would have taken out the expenses for Iraq because Iraqi blood is not red enough to save. That’s less than $600B.
We know that.
What else would you have stricken?
So, how about less dancing and less finger pointing.
What would you have used your pen on?
Democrap governess on parade. Detroit all council members being investigated, mayor in prison, schools taken over by the state. Police stations cut in half, along with fire stations, population cut from 2.5 million down to 800K. How many more examples do you need BLAST. I would like you to close your mouth and open your eyes and ears, can’t you see what the Democraps have done, and what they really stand for. POWER AT ALL COSTS.
Ummm… A LIE????? The bill was introduced by the REPUBLICAN SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE DENNIS HASTERT I would tend to think the Republican controlled House and Senate during 2003 and having the Presidency would be enough to say the Republicans were responsible for it.
Don’t you think that makes it a REPUBLICAN BILL?
This argument is not about what I would have done as President, but what Bush did and what Obama is doing. I have stated my position on deficit spending and the need for a constitutional amendment for a balanced budget. As to particulars, there are many places where either the budgets should have been cut or taxes raised. It is that simple.
Here is George Bush’s record on the growth of the national debt: $4,898,681,252,731.43
2001 $194,126,042,892.82
2002 $465,519,336,577.58
2003 $618,992,896,783.52
2004 $606,381,539,892.88
2005 $562,527,680,664.50
2006 $499,341,790,544.61
2007 $513,555,204,392.91
2008 $1,438,236,760,982.61
That does not even account for the MASSIVE increase of the TRADE DEFICIT which nearly doubled during his Presidency. $411 Billion to $751 Billion… How did this add to our national security or long term stability?
Take those two deficits, add to it a lack of oversight on banks and financial institutions and we hollowed out our entire economy in the past 8+ years. What part of “conservative” spends money like this, what part of “conservative” allows foreign countries to sell goods undervalued into their country?
@blast:
So, once again, you’ve proven that you’re long on blame and finger pointing but remarkably short on answers and solutions.
Just wanted to make sure that was obvious to everyone.
Remember, if you’re not part of the solution, you’re part of the problem.
PS….You’ll notice that my statements regarding the prescription drug bill are not in my response above. I edited that out after posting it.
The posts that end up in your e-mail are not always the final version.
I see, you edited out the whole “lie line” once you realized you were the one perpetuating a lie… I do not use email comments to reply. I read your comment here. Thank you for correcting the record to your misinformation.
You bet I am finger pointing… just like the little boy in the story of “The Emperor’s New Clothes”… I don’t have to delineate specifics on his naked spending as pointing to his catastrophic results are quite enough.
@reckless: Thank you for those comments… I especially liked “The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other peoples money.”
I wrote a post a week before the election “What happens the Day After You Kill the Goose that Lays the Golden Eggs?” I never thought we’d be on the verge of serving that goose the first few weeks into the Obama presidency.
And we both know that if Bush, or ANY Republican were serving Waygu beef at the White House the lefties in the “news” media would have run a slew of stories asking what signal that sends to the little people who are suffering. Especially on top of the most expensive Inauguration in history.
Instead of those kinds of news stories we are getting spam comments of undisguised Bush bile from bl ass t; an enabler of the same massive spending under Obama that he is complaining about with Bush who by any measure was a piker in that regard.
Mike, one could call you an enabler of false information about President Bush. Bush was a piker? Laughable.
@blast: Give it a rest Bush basher. You’re boring me. You’re nothing but an enabler for deficit spending on an unprecedented scale.
@blast:
You bet I am finger pointing… just like the little boy in the story of “The Emperor’s New Clothes”… I don’t have to delineate specifics on his naked spending as pointing to his catastrophic results are quite enough.
Reply
Now, back to the topic:
Has anyone gone over to Stimulus Watch to actually see what the stimulus will be spent on in your neck of the woods?
I’m most excited about the $99,600 we are spending on doorbells in Laurel, MS;
and the $500,000 we will be spending on the dog park in Chula Vista, CA;
and the $50,000 we will be spending on two dog parks in Lewiston, ME;
and the $17,500,000,000.00 we will be spending on New Energy Efficiency Industrial Zones in Cidra, PR;
and the $600,000,000.00.00 we will be spending on the Forks of the Road Heritage Trail.
My absolute mostest favorite though is the $393,000.00 for patrol rifles for Pembroke Pines, FL. This town has a population of 147,000 people. Why do they need nearly four hundred thousand dollars for rifles?
Dog parks? that’s a sore, sore subject. We have dog parks here that you have to pay for. We paid the $60.00 yearly fee for a local park, went one time and our little 17 pound Rio(aka little satan) was not welcome to come back, not a pleasant day. We didn’t even ask for a refund, now we will be expected to pay for someone else’s dog parks?
Here’s another one:
SEMA is opposing an effort by some Washington lawmakers to include a national car crushing program in the upcoming economic stimulus package. Vehicles targeted for the scrap pile will likely include Chevy Blazers, Silverados, S-10s and Tahoes; Dodge Dakotas and Rams; Ford Explorers and F-Series; Jeep Cherokees and Wranglers; and any other SUV or truck that obtains less than 18 mpg.
Under the plan, the federal government would pay a premium for ’99 and newer cars. Click here to oppose the legislation.
The so-called “Accelerated Retirement of Inefficient Vehicles Act” is “Cash for Clunkers” with a twist. Instead of focusing exclusively on old cars as is typical with scrappage programs, this bill will target any vehicle with lower fuel-economy ratings. Participants will receive a cash voucher to purchase a more fuel-efficient new car or used car (model year 2004 or later) or receive credit for the purchase of public transportation tickets.
Under the legislation, “fuel efficient” means at least 25% better mileage than the CAFE standard. It will be illegal to resell the scrapped vehicles. Bill sponsors want to destroy 4 million pickups and SUVs over the next four years.
Read more:
http://www.sema.org/Main/ArticleDetail.aspx?contentID=61134
http://www.noquarterusa.net/blog/2009/02/01/heres-the-beef/
Japanese beef at $100/lb. served at White House coctail party.
Home values are up here in Wyoming too, or at least my tax valuation is. My taxes haves almost doubled in the three years I have lived in my current house. I offered to sell it the the assessor for the valued amount, but he didn’t think I was very funny.
@Missy:
Yes, I saw the SEMA story yesterday.
I’ve been stewing over that one but haven’t made the time to do a post on it.
It’s unbelievable what this gov’t is doing.
Unbelievable.
According to theOne
Selling cheap Chinese made plastic models of the White House in the capital gift shop = Bad
Serving outrageously expensive Japanese grown beef in the White House = Good
Apparently, while there are plenty of American companies fighting to fill the capital gift shop with products, there aren’t any American ranchers growing quality beef.
Hope and Change we can believe in!
@Aye Chihuahua:
I saved this article so hubby could see it, he restores older Jeeps. If they do this all the parts that he and other jeepers need would wind up crushed, who would want to invest in something that couldn’t be repaired because the parts would become almost impossible to find? This would also be a problem for all other makes and models of vehicles that are collected. Next step is going to be to not allow licensing for these evil polluters. We will just have to make a lawn ornament out of hubby’s cherry 82 Scrambler that only gets driven a couple of times a year.
@Wisdom:
Our son-in-law gifts us with elk from Colorado. Has to be much healthier than that outrageously costly Japanese beef Obama is eating and it’s from this country.
BTW, is this the beef that isn’t allowed to graze naturally? I remember something about the Japanese having the beef suspended in some sort of hanging thing throughout their lives and not allowed any roaming. Is this what Obama is eating?
What part of specific details are missed in my annualized delineation of ENORMOUS DEFICITS?
I guess Aye you don’t know the process of government. Both houses of Congress have to pass the bill and it has to be signed by the president before it actually spends a dime. I am totally against all the pork, but your disingenuous comment dismisses my points about the past REAL deficits.
Aye, your memory is not very good. I offered specifics… Remember saying I don’t like “brown people” after saying the war was a waste of money. Do you remember I called out the Republican Prescription Drug Plan, and then you called that a lie, only to retract your statement because you probably looked it up to find that Speaker Hastert had been the person to bring the bill. What about the pork I mentioned? Ok, how about the missing money the Heritage Foundation reported a couple of years back?
Prescription Drug Plan -$1.2 Trillion
The Iraq War, -$600 Billion
Pork -$170.7 Billion
Heritage Foundation Estimate of “Missing Money” -$25 Billion
I have provided specifics Aye. Maybe you need to recognize that President George Bush nearly doubled the national debt in 8 years and left the economy in a ditch.
@blast:
Round and round and round you go.
You’re getting a little closer though you still haven’t come up with anything near the total of what you’re bitchin’ about.
Today is only the fourth day of our discussion.
Maybe you need just a little more time.
You’re correct about how the process of gov’t works, and yes, I understand it perfectly. Perhaps better than you do in fact.
The difference is that I’m bitchin’ about it BEFORE it happens in order to prevent it because once it’s signed and spent, it’s done. Gov’t spending, by its’ very nature, doesn’t go in reverse.
You choose to remain relatively silent because it hasn’t been spent yet. I guess you’re just gonna cover your eyes, ears, and mouth while hoping for the best.
The whole barn door, horse thing comes to mind or perhaps you’re more familiar with the spilled milk or water under the bridge analogies.
Again, if you’re not part of the solution, you’re part of the problem.
Smart enough to see the difference?
As I follow the bill, I think there is a lot in this “stimulus” bill that doesn’t make sense. I’m a BIGTIME Obama supporter as many of you know, but I think he is making a mistake by not shelving this bill and make the Congress start over. I think a stimulus package is necessary but you only get one shot to write a $1 trillion check and that money has to get spent in a way that we can recoup it later.
Some money has to go to helping working families. My girl lost her job and in 40 days hasn’t received one call and she is highly qualified in her field. We’re just making it and if the recession goes on long, we’ll probably lose quite a bit. So far we’re good because I make enough to handle the bills but I’m worried about my job.
Still, I’m not in support of this bill and I understand how blast could point to Bush because these GOPers didn’t complain when Bush spent like a drunken sailor. But as Democrats, we have to be willing to disagree with President Obama when we see fit. I’m a supporter, not a robot. We need a better bill.
I knew you would say that. Like you want me to detail $5 Trillion of the f-ed up spending over the past years. I have made enough illustrative examples to satisfy your question. So stop with your false argument and vitriolic spin. You speak of problem and solution. I see part of the problem is not acknowledging where we have been. You refuse to accept the truth no matter how much it is detailed and instead resort to your normal personal attacks. Talk about obfuscation!
Aye, conservatives once lived by principled positions. Where is the principal of running up and near $5 Trillion debt in the past 8 years… answer that! What is your excuse for President Bush and the Republican Congress spending $1.2 Trillion on The Prescription Drug Bill? ANSWER THAT!
@james manning:
First, James, let me say that the two snippets above are representative of the reason that I appreciate your presence here.
You and I don’t agree on everything, nor will we ever.
We do share the ability however to think independently and be critical and harsh when necessary. We are both willing to apply criticism to both sides of the aisle as needed.
You bring up the complaining by blast. Let me say that I agree with a lot of what he is saying.
(I haven’t told him that because he hasn’t taken the time to breathe and ask me the question. You and I can keep that between us.)
The difference is that I can point to very specific errors in spending and judgment made over the last eight years without resorting to the blanket “Bush” “Bush “Bush” routine that he chooses to engage in. Just as I am perfectly capable of pointing out the errors in spending that BO and the Dim controlled Congress are making now.
BO’s honeymoon is going to be a short one with all of this spending, the complete disconnect from the people here in the “real world”, the corrupt appointees, the complete lack of transparency, and movements moving toward greater secrecy and less accountability.
BO is off to a really rocky start and is making things worse through his ram rod, “I won”, my way approach.
You are totally correct on my feelings toward some GOPers. Add to that the constant drivel about how great a President Bush was, when in truth his Presidency failed demonstrably to live up to conservative principals in so many ways.
As to the stimulus bill… it was dead on arrival when it got to the Senate. I think we will see more compromise and if we don’t then Obama should reject the mess.
I am not actually a Democrat James. I once considered myself a Republican, but that party does not actually exist anymore and I don’t see it returning for some time.
@blast: If you can’t stick to the topic without the usual Bush Bash bile I am going to delete your comments.
This thread is all about STOPPING big spending… not enabling it.
mikeA censoring debate as usual.
@blast: Unending Bush Bashing is not a debate and we are ALL tired of it.
Give it a rest or else.
*There’s” the James Manning I remember… LOL If there is to be this massive amount of spending, there needs to be more time to see just how they are spending it, and what it is supposed to “create” in jobs. Do we really need to expand government jobs? Do we place such faith in temporary jobs if they do not lead to more permanent jobs? And shouldn’t we be informed on how many of each are in that promising “job creation” figure?
Agreed that the past 12 years have been the economic snowball from hell that smacked reality in the our faces a year and a half ago…. under the Bush Administration. I do not agree with blast that this is an onus borne just by Bush and the GOP for their failure to stave off the inevitable. I place even more blame on Congress… *both* parties…. for this.
There were half-hearted tries in 2003 and 2005 by Bush and some GOP voices. The did not get enough support from their own, or the Dems. Greenspan was majorly in error with his handling of the interest rates, but had Bush replaced him with Bernanke sooner, I doubt it would have been handled any better. Perhaps we would have just seen banking “federalized” a lot sooner.
Also, blast… I really can’t agree with the “meaning of *is*” type argument that Obama’s spending isn’t a reality because Congress hasn’t passed the bill… This is a nit pick thing, guy. What is obvious is it’s not a matter of “if”, but “when and how much”. So if you want to play the game that Obama’s pushing and prodding for big spending doesn’t count until he signs the bill, you may be technically correct. But you are still far from the mark in defending his plans in spending. Something that will be easily achieved in the first two years with the Congressional composition.
I have no doubts that under this President, we will see the budget astronomically increased for social welfare, expensive and inefficient cars and alternative energy, affirmative action administration and increased programs, and more Education Dept money being thrown down the drain.
But if you want to deal with he’s done, and doing…. He’s increased international spending for abortion by lifting the bans. The first bill out of the gate was the Lily Ledbetter, increasing litigation rights (and thereby more costs, as litigation usually begats). He’s pushing Congress to pass the porkulus, and tho it doesn’t need the GOP approval, they are slinging media mud at anyone who opposes it as those advocating for America’s economic failure.
In the meantime, I’ve seen a couple of articles over the past few days that indicates Obama might be rethinking his Afghanistan “surge”. Now I wonder just what he does have planned for the military defense budget. Not sure what the financial repercussions are going to be for transferring, trying and holding terror suspects on US soil and running them thru our court systems, but I doubt it’s going to be cheaper than military tribunals.
Call me old fashioned, but I believe my federal government is supposed to safeguard our nation and print money. The rest of their dalliance I just consider part of their decades old over reach for power. Just like the New Deal stepped up that interference and control considerably in a short time… and continued a slow increase… I think this Obama term is going to result in another high speed boost in federal control.
And I, for one, don’t like it.
And oh, BTW, Eric #3. If you knew anything about FEMA’s organization prior to Bush’s administration, you’d know they were inefficient (as most federal departments) before Katrina. They have, however, become far more efficient after Katrina. It’s not a Bush creation, it was a Bush inheritance.. that has been improved.
Katrina put far more demands on FEMA than ever experienced. Ice storms in Kentucky should be a breeze after Katrina. However in order for FEMA to work, the lower local, county and state authorities must do their bit as well. I believe the appropriate criticism should be directed to the press… who publicly blamed Bush for FEMA’s performance and accused him of racism, and yet give Obama as pass for even less publicly demonstrated concern for the citizens of Kentucky.
I hear you, don’t get me wrong, the idea of stimulus is sickening in the first place, secondly, the package that passed the house is atrocious. I think Pelosi from the ‘get go’ is the biggest idiot on the planet for including some of the pork that got into the bill… some of which was yanked out because of bad PR. What are they thinking!
In the risk of being censored…
BUSH BASHING BILE DELETED
If there were an easy solution to this we would have done it by now. Nancy P. is tone deaf and that’s why we have this bill. But something needs to get done because we are shedding jobs very fast and people are losing their homes at record numbers. I’m not an economist so I really can say what should happen.
@Mata, I haven’t gone anywhere it’s just that anytime I disagree with you guys I get insulted as Hard Right did in another post.
To James:
Hard Right is a lunatic and does not represent the true quality of authors and posters on FA. Mata, Wordsmith, Curt, Rob, Scott, Rocky B., Aye, Missy…and sometimes Mike A (when he’s taken his Prozac) are examples of people who are open to debate, even if they don’t agree with you, without being insulting. Of course if you start out with an insulting tone, you’re pretty much dead meat.
Anyway my point being, Hard Right is the angry little man who gets off through insults and jabs.
So just ignore him.
Ron
@Ron:
That made me laugh.
I needed it today.
Thanks.
@james manning:
Callouses man.
You gotta grow yourself some callouses and sharpen your elbows.
Don’t make yourself a stranger.
With a little work, we could turn you into a fine conservative.
The secret to getting this economy back on track is three fold:
1) Sensible, across the board tax cuts including, but not limited to, capital gains, business, personal income, real estate, etc.
2) Across the board spending cuts starting with the $93,000 per representative petty cash increase that each CongressCritter just received and the $100 plus per pound steak that is being eaten at the White House.
3) Get the Fed Gov’t out of the economy/free market. Make the free market “free” again.
There’s a huge amount that can be done outside of $1 TRILLION of useless spending which will have to be followed up by more spending.
SPENDING will not solve this. Did anyone learn the lesson that the Great Depression and the New Deal should have taught us?
We desperately need to get back to the principles of the Founding Fathers.
We’ve lost our way and the only way to find our way back to the path is to figure out where the path is.
@Ron: Insulting me while making a plea for civility is one sure way to earn you the label HYPOCRITE!
You’re in my house now so mind your manners.
@aye,
don’t worry. i don’t sweat the insults. i can dish as much as i can take. besides, when its all said and done, i’m going to end the day with some good food and a nice dose of 24 on the big screen. and i’m sure most of you folks are much nicer in person… not that i’d ever want to meet of you
Mitch McConnell advocates allowing all credit worthy Americans to finance or refinance their homes with government-backed, 4% – 4.5% mortgages.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/02/02/republicans-stimulus-address-housing-crisis/
I think this is a darn good idea.
- Larry Weisenthal/Huntington Beach, CA
I’m not so sure, Larry. But then, I’m not sure what McConnell means by “government backed”.
For example VA loans are government “guaranteed” by the VA Dept for veterans and active service members. FHA/HUD loans are government “insured”. Most loans, even those made by the private sector, are bought out and held by Fannie/Freddie… GSE’s. And as I think last year showed, they’ve decided that GSE means the govt will bail them out, despite no mandated obligation to do so. In all cases, “government” is taking responsibility for these loans in the event of default.
To shuffle massive amounts of refinances and purchase loans will bog down a system already in overload. Even now, so many refinance closings are going far beyond the three day rescission date because of backlog. And add to that, many of those “job losses” touted for the past year have occurred in the mortgage/banking/lending industry, real estate professions and occupations related to construction/building/remodeling. This means the banking and/or lending facilities have few representatives doing the needed jobs to push this thru now.
And frankly, if the rates are low enough, it doesn’t make much difference whether that 4-5% is with a government “insure”, “guarantee” or “backed” (in McConnell terms)…. except that it will transfer the risk of default to the government… or, in reality, the taxpayers. Quite frankly, most of the loans will end up in the Fannie/Freddie portfolio… despite it’s origination. Just as it’s been for years.
McConnell’s proposal will increase the government bureauracy to implement it, shooting up costs.
To me, this seems like taking what the private sector can already do – with loans issued privately but purchased by the GSE’s on the secondary market – and getting us nowhere but just creating a larger percentage of possible defaults the the taxpayer has to bail out.
Then the other issue I don’t see addressed (and haven’t read McConnells bill for specifics and don’t see it yet on Gov Track) is whether this allows for a LTV (loan to value) limit. In other words, borrowers may take advantage of the cheap rates and keep their payments high by pulling out any equity, and have a loan that is close to 100% of the current (and probably dropping) value of the home.
Another monkey wrench in the works that’s a debacle waiting to happen.
From the article you linked, I have to agree with the naysayers on this one.
The more the government is on the hook for defaulted loans, and the more in danger of bleeding cash the taxpayer is.
Heaven help us from either party and their “solutions”… because no matter which side of the aisle they come from, it all ends up being the burden of the tax payers, and not wise practices by the private sector. It’s time to bite the bullet, let the time pass with minimal government input, and let the market values correct, and lending practices return to sane qualifications for borrowers pre-1996 criteria.
Missy #42
They’re talking the creme de la creme Kobe beef from Japan. I’ve had some, and one can’t deny that it’s truly top notch stuff. It’s different not only from the very select breed, but the very slow and methodical care for the cattle. Talk about “happy cows”, they are fed organic grains, Japanese beer, and sake mash.
If you’ve ever tasted the difference between organic fed roasting chickens, and those you buy in the store, you’ll know what I mean. I have some friends with an organic chicken farm, now gettting into other arenas. I buy all my roasting hens from them (supporting my local small businesses… :0), and use them for my holiday meals instead of turkeys. It’s much the same with Kobe beef.
But we have great local farms here with “happy cows”. Perhaps not the quality of Kobe beef, but distinctly better than your run of the mill beef from the grocery store chains.
Not to get into the argument of justifying Kobe beef being served at the WH, as I’m sure they’d always have prime quality food for guests and the POTUS. But it would be nice to see them serving top of the line US beef product instead.
But perhaps our resident cowboy, Wisdom, can add some sage advice on beef here as well.
blast, INRE your comment #53:
Let’s talk about US economics and a POTUS’s responsibility in general. You can’t say that the Bush admin has culpability, yet not admit prior administrations’ culpability that led to his circumstance. Remember that Reagan inherited a Carter admin that was on a steady upswing, and it took most of the Reagan years to reverse that trend. This stuff doesn’t have a “fiscal year” that relates to POTUS terms in reality.
I think most of us agree that the Republican Congress and Bush spending isn’t anything to hang his Stetson on for a legacy. Where I do believe Bush was a “historic leader” was in foreign policy. And we can debate that stuff on other threads and dodge Mike’s “thread nanny” instincts.. which he picked up from me, mind you. LOL Guilty as charged.
Fact is a “true historic leader” still needs a cooperative Congress that controls the purse strings. The quid pro quo in the beltway is shameful, and real. Bills may have been signed that… had they been clean and on subject/target… may have been veto’ed. But so far… if you are looking for a “true historic leader” in these early days, it looks like we may be worse off than under what you so chastise with Bush.
Congress… with Bush’s power of the pen… overspent. This Congress… with Obama’s power of the pen… is armed to overspend in it’s first weeks of governance. It’s not a good start.
All any of us can do is find the places that we agree, and hope to thwart more economic damage that is on the horizon.
I’m not defending the stimulus. The only part of any of the bailout or stimulus plans which make any sense at all to me is Mitch McConnell’s recent trial balloon that the US govt should guarantee mortgages and refinancings to all qualified borrowers at 4% – 4.5% interest rates.
Having said that, you are wildly lowballing the ultimate cost of the Iraq War:
http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/features/2008/04/stiglitz200804
Please don’t just say “Vanity Fair” and dismiss this. Post, if you have a different credible estimate, a link to a different forecast of the ultimate cost of the Iraq War.
- Larry Weisenthal/Huntington Beach, CA
I have no problem blaming Clinton as well… We knew there was a Clinton hangover, but Bush BUSH BASHING DELETED
Carter was president for 4 years, and of course the economy was trashed. Do you consider the economy worse today than during Carter?
BUSH BASHING DELETED
[edited by post moderator]
Going on memory here, blast.
No I do not consider the economy worse than under the problems instigated by Carter. And no….. totally disagree that today’s economic problems have *anything* to do with defense spending. It’s a drop in the bucket by comparison at approx $5-7bil monthly. Also, had not the Bush cuts been in force after 911, this economy would be worse.
But thread “rules”… we’re not talking defense spending here. Just domestic economic spending.
And the “7 years/music stopped” doesn’t apply. The full force of the housing/lending crash didn’t occur until late 2006/early 2007. Too late to correct the problems that started it a decade before. It was inevitable it would be a “hangover”.
Larry, perhaps I’m missing something… When did anyone say “vanity fair” or “wildly” underestimate Iraq costs? Sort of an out of the blue comment here that I can see.
But then… don’t answer. We’re not talking defense spending here..
But wait.. there’s MORE! (at the risk of being deleted myself by the thread nanny, which I will graciously accept… :0) Defense spending is STILL a drop in the bucket compared to what is going on by all accounts. Not to mention,as a taxpayer, I’ll take a hit on defense spending before I take a hit on social welfare any day. It is the prime reason that the feds exist, IMHO.
@MataHarley:
Thanks Mata. I’ve had organic chicken, our friends down south just call them fresh. It’s like eating a tomato off the vine as opposed to hot house tomatoes IMO.
The only farming we do on our farm is hay, from time to time we sell it to an organic buffalo farmer. We had a Springer Spaniel for 15 years that had a terrible reaction when our neighbors had their lawn treated, she almost died. From that point on, my husband would not allow any chemicals to be used on any of the acreage because she roamed every square inch of the place. So, now it’s been over 19 years without chemicals, it tested out to be able to be able to be sold as organic, the buffalo farmer had that done when he became interested in it.
We have a farmer friend down there that wants to triple our hay income, claims he can come in and make the place a real money maker, hubby said no because he’s afraid the same thing could happen to the little guy we have now. He won’t even let me use weed-be-gone.
To Mike:
I wasn’t making a plea for civility whatsoever Mike so you apparently misinterpreted my comments. I was explaining to James that Hard Right is abrasive and rude. That was the point of my post. At the same time I was trying to pay a compliment to some of the authors and posters on FA. And yes I took a lighthearted jab at you but you obviously took offense so for that I APOLOGIZE!
Having said that I’ll just come right out and say what I think, without insulting you. I do think you insult people more than any other author on here. I do think you come across as angry in some of your posts. I do think you censor posters far too much as well.
And I remember the back and forth between you and Wordsmith about the subject of civility between posters. Wordsmith sounded much more civil than you. Sorry but that’s my opinion.
I’m not saying this to start a fight or to make you look bad Mike, I’m trying to point out something as a reader of your threads and posts. You are extremely intelligent and articulate with your arguments, but to me, the anger and insults takes away from your points. It makes you sound unreasonable when in fact I know you are.
I just think we are better than that….but as you said it’s your house Mike so if you like, I won’t post anymore comments on your threads and I won’t make any more comments about you.
One final comment:
I’ll always apologize or admit a mistakes when they occur, but don’t mistake me for some sort of pussy. The hypocrite insult was way out of line and you don’t know me well enough to insult me like that Mike! You are wrong, very wrong!
But I’ll let it slide since you felt insulted first.
Ron
@Ron: Ron: If you find my posts so angry and insulting there is no one forcing you to read them. You’re more than welcome to ignore them entirely.
Wordsmith’s civility and his willingness to bend over backwards to be fair to moonbats is commendable. But we don’t live in a world of uniformity and it would be a dull dull blog if everyone who contributed here comported themselves exactly the same.
Frankly, I think we need a bit more of an edge in our politics on the GOP side. Far too often we’re being told to go along to get along. That kind of bipartisanship always seems to be a one way street.
I don’t see how we can ask our GOP leaders to show a little backbone if we aren’t willing to express our own emotions rather strongly from time to time.
And I do take a page out of Obama’s book. You may recall he instructed his supporters to get in our faces and challenge us.
You may decide to take a different tack in responding to that or in general how you wish to communicate on political issues.
Is your way better?
The old saying goes “you catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar” but I don’t see the people who follow that line catching many flies. Do you?
Again, it’s a difference in tone we are talking about here. And if you don’t like mine, well that’s too bad. I wasn’t put on this earth to make everyone happy.
And yes, if you insist on insulting me with some comment about “prozac” then you have some nerve saying that my response was out of line. Or do you follow the Democrat playbook where anything you say is excused (an honest mistake perhaps) and any response is condemned?
Man up Ron! See Skye’s post on getting a pair if you need assistance.
To mike:
Democrat playbook? Do you even know my politics? By your comment I’d say you don’t. But I’m not surprised. You strike me as someone who shoots first and asks questions later which is to your disadvantage as it makes you sound uninformed. I’m certainly not a Democrat (I’d never vote for one) so I’m not sure where that comes from.
I was trying to be nice and offer an apology but of course you respond exactly how I described you (angry and insulting)so you just proved my point. You always attack people on your side of the political spectrum? I agree with about 90% of what you post but the fact that I am not mean and spiteful like you, I must be weak or something right? You’re funny Mike, really funny.
I said it was a lighthearted jab and not an insult but apparently you don’t understand what that means so I won’t bother trying to explain it to you. Obviously you lack a sense of humor.
And get a pair? Man up? My pair are bigger than your pair Mike. Much bigger. I just don’t have to act like you to prove it. Ever heard of walk softly and carry a big stick? Apparently not.
It’s easy to act tough on a website Mike. Real life is a whole different story Mike. And trust me when I tell you, people that actually know me, would beg to differ with your childish remark but then again you have no idea what you are talking about.
This has been educational.
Ron
“Or do you follow the Democrat playbook where anything you say is excused (an honest mistake perhaps) and any response is condemned?”
That was a question Ron, not an accusation.
Seems to me YOU are the one being hypersensitive here.
Oh well, as I said, it’s not my job to try and please everyone. I just hope that for every unsatisfied reader I have two who are.
to Mike:
l shouldn’t of said anything. Again my fault.
Ron
You’re forgiven Ron.
Thank you!
Well, I grew up in a butcher shop (no, not Butch Cassidy’s, but a few blocks away) but I’m hardly an expert on cattle. I’ve had Kobe beef, and while it was good, I wouldn’t say it’s worth alienating the American people over. Honestly, my problem with it being served in the WH is less about the fact he served expensive food, and more about the hypocrisy of serving expensive food while asking the American people for an extra trillion dollars, preaching sacrifice, and at the same time lambasting corporate America for their own excesses.
The President should be eating fine foods in the WH while he entertains visiting heads of state, but that party wasn’t for visiting heads of state, it was for visiting Obamatons and supporters.
As for this “cowboy’s” sage advice on beef? Ribeye, thick cut, medium rare. 9 Iron Grill at the golf course in Rock Springs, El Toro’s in Hudson, and Fire Rock in Casper all serve damn good steaks. If you’re cooking it at home, spend the extra money and get buffalo. Sooooo much better than even Kobe beef.