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	<title>Comments on: Bush throws down gauntlet for Obama on &#8220;right to die&#8221; and abortion with &#8220;conscience rule&#8221;</title>
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	<link>http://floppingaces.net/2008/12/19/bush-throws-down-gauntlet-for-obama-on-right-to-die-and-abortion-with-conscience-rule/?utm_source=rss&#038;utm_medium=rss&#038;utm_campaign=bush-throws-down-gauntlet-for-obama-on-right-to-die-and-abortion-with-conscience-rule</link>
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		<title>By: Craig</title>
		<link>http://floppingaces.net/2008/12/19/bush-throws-down-gauntlet-for-obama-on-right-to-die-and-abortion-with-conscience-rule/comment-page-1/#comment-143795</link>
		<dc:creator>Craig</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Dec 2008 01:06:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=13834#comment-143795</guid>
		<description>The Simple Human Decency of George Bush
By: Rick Moran
Monday, December 22, 2008 
http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_simple_human_decency_of_george_bush/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<!-- google_ad_section_start --><p>The Simple Human Decency of George Bush<br />
By: Rick Moran<br />
Monday, December 22, 2008<br />
<a href="http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_simple_human_decency_of_george_bush/" rel="nofollow">http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/the_simple_human_decency_of_george_bush/</a></p>
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		<title>By: Red73</title>
		<link>http://floppingaces.net/2008/12/19/bush-throws-down-gauntlet-for-obama-on-right-to-die-and-abortion-with-conscience-rule/comment-page-1/#comment-143618</link>
		<dc:creator>Red73</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Dec 2008 16:41:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=13834#comment-143618</guid>
		<description>Mata: &quot;Would love to know if he voted for the IL Conscience Act&quot;

Probably: &quot;Present.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<!-- google_ad_section_start --><p>Mata: &#8220;Would love to know if he voted for the IL Conscience Act&#8221;</p>
<p>Probably: &#8220;Present.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: MataHarley</title>
		<link>http://floppingaces.net/2008/12/19/bush-throws-down-gauntlet-for-obama-on-right-to-die-and-abortion-with-conscience-rule/comment-page-1/#comment-143486</link>
		<dc:creator>MataHarley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 18:05:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=13834#comment-143486</guid>
		<description>Missy, good example in IL you cited.  Blagoejvich&#039;s 2005 &quot;emergency rule&quot; forced pharmacists to distribute the pill under threat of sanction or loss of license.  Intimidation?

The IL Supreme Court overturned a previously &quot;dismissed&quot; case INRE Blago&#039;s &quot;rule&quot; saying the pharmacists have a right to defend their right of conscience in court.  The lower courts refused to hear their lawsuits.  With the IL Supremes saying they got to be heard, the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.individual.com/story.php?story=93809103&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;b&gt;cases return to the Sangamon Circuit Court to be heard.&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/a&gt;

Whether they win their lawsuit remains yet to be seen.  Should be interesting to follow.

The reason the IL Supreme&#039;s said they had the right to be heard in court?  IL passed one of those &quot;conscience rules&quot; evidently...  I believe called the Conscience Act.  I&#039;ll have to look that up. Wonder if Obama was involved as a State Senator, and how he voted.

For the record, the Supreme&#039;s refrained on commenting on the constitutionality of &quot;the rule&quot;, and merely stated the lawsuit has the right to be heard.  In other words, they only address the decision of the lower courts.  You &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.state.il.us/court/OPINIONS/SupremeCourt/2008/December/104692.pdf&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;b&gt; can read the IL Supreme&#039;s opinion here.&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/a&gt;

BTW, according to &lt;a href=&quot;http://indianalawblog.com/archives/2008/12/law_illinois_an.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;b&gt; The Indiana Law Blog, &lt;/a&gt;&lt;/b&gt; the Obama transition team is already examing the Bush conscience rule and figuring out the best way to &quot;undo&quot; it.  Guess now we know...  

Would love to know if he voted for the IL Conscience Act</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<!-- google_ad_section_start --><p>Missy, good example in IL you cited.  Blagoejvich&#8217;s 2005 &#8220;emergency rule&#8221; forced pharmacists to distribute the pill under threat of sanction or loss of license.  Intimidation?</p>
<p>The IL Supreme Court overturned a previously &#8220;dismissed&#8221; case INRE Blago&#8217;s &#8220;rule&#8221; saying the pharmacists have a right to defend their right of conscience in court.  The lower courts refused to hear their lawsuits.  With the IL Supremes saying they got to be heard, the <a href="http://www.individual.com/story.php?story=93809103" rel="nofollow"><b>cases return to the Sangamon Circuit Court to be heard.</b></a></p>
<p>Whether they win their lawsuit remains yet to be seen.  Should be interesting to follow.</p>
<p>The reason the IL Supreme&#8217;s said they had the right to be heard in court?  IL passed one of those &#8220;conscience rules&#8221; evidently&#8230;  I believe called the Conscience Act.  I&#8217;ll have to look that up. Wonder if Obama was involved as a State Senator, and how he voted.</p>
<p>For the record, the Supreme&#8217;s refrained on commenting on the constitutionality of &#8220;the rule&#8221;, and merely stated the lawsuit has the right to be heard.  In other words, they only address the decision of the lower courts.  You <a href="http://www.state.il.us/court/OPINIONS/SupremeCourt/2008/December/104692.pdf" rel="nofollow"><b> can read the IL Supreme&#8217;s opinion here.</b></a></p>
<p>BTW, according to <a href="http://indianalawblog.com/archives/2008/12/law_illinois_an.html" rel="nofollow"><b> The Indiana Law Blog, </b></a> the Obama transition team is already examing the Bush conscience rule and figuring out the best way to &#8220;undo&#8221; it.  Guess now we know&#8230;  </p>
<p>Would love to know if he voted for the IL Conscience Act</p>
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		<title>By: mlajoie2</title>
		<link>http://floppingaces.net/2008/12/19/bush-throws-down-gauntlet-for-obama-on-right-to-die-and-abortion-with-conscience-rule/comment-page-1/#comment-143478</link>
		<dc:creator>mlajoie2</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 16:39:08 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Way to go, Mata!  What a great article!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<!-- google_ad_section_start --><p>Way to go, Mata!  What a great article!</p>
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		<title>By: MataHarley</title>
		<link>http://floppingaces.net/2008/12/19/bush-throws-down-gauntlet-for-obama-on-right-to-die-and-abortion-with-conscience-rule/comment-page-1/#comment-143474</link>
		<dc:creator>MataHarley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 15:40:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=13834#comment-143474</guid>
		<description>ICC&amp;P #7.  In all honesty, the &quot;conscience rule&quot; should not affect Obama&#039;s plans for increased funding for reproductive rights.  It does not eliminate any procedures.  It just allows some doctors to voluntarily &quot;opt out&quot; without suffering any repercussions.

There will still be plenty of doctors around who will abort on demand.  And for states like Oregon, assisted suicide for the terminally ill will continue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<!-- google_ad_section_start --><p>ICC&#038;P #7.  In all honesty, the &#8220;conscience rule&#8221; should not affect Obama&#8217;s plans for increased funding for reproductive rights.  It does not eliminate any procedures.  It just allows some doctors to voluntarily &#8220;opt out&#8221; without suffering any repercussions.</p>
<p>There will still be plenty of doctors around who will abort on demand.  And for states like Oregon, assisted suicide for the terminally ill will continue.</p>
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		<title>By: MataHarley</title>
		<link>http://floppingaces.net/2008/12/19/bush-throws-down-gauntlet-for-obama-on-right-to-die-and-abortion-with-conscience-rule/comment-page-1/#comment-143473</link>
		<dc:creator>MataHarley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 15:37:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=13834#comment-143473</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;To my knowledge, some OBGYNS have always refused to perform abortions with no legal consequences.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Always on Watch, I believe the problem for the objectors is less litigation from patients, as they can go elsewhere... but repercussions from the facility where they are employed.  Obviously, if they are a one practitioner business, they won&#039;t be firing themselves.  However the lawsuits mentioned in the OP were from those who were forced to perform these procedures under pressure from their employers.

While I agree with the premise that doctors should not be forced to do procedures that they believe violate principles, I can also recognize it can become a slippery slope.  As I said, this isn&#039;t such a clear cut issue, depending upon the devil in the details of the rules language.... which I haven&#039;t seen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<!-- google_ad_section_start --><blockquote><p>To my knowledge, some OBGYNS have always refused to perform abortions with no legal consequences.</p></blockquote>
<p>Always on Watch, I believe the problem for the objectors is less litigation from patients, as they can go elsewhere&#8230; but repercussions from the facility where they are employed.  Obviously, if they are a one practitioner business, they won&#8217;t be firing themselves.  However the lawsuits mentioned in the OP were from those who were forced to perform these procedures under pressure from their employers.</p>
<p>While I agree with the premise that doctors should not be forced to do procedures that they believe violate principles, I can also recognize it can become a slippery slope.  As I said, this isn&#8217;t such a clear cut issue, depending upon the devil in the details of the rules language&#8230;. which I haven&#8217;t seen.</p>
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		<title>By: Missy</title>
		<link>http://floppingaces.net/2008/12/19/bush-throws-down-gauntlet-for-obama-on-right-to-die-and-abortion-with-conscience-rule/comment-page-1/#comment-143464</link>
		<dc:creator>Missy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 13:45:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=13834#comment-143464</guid>
		<description>We just went through this in Illinois with pharmacists, the now embattled gov felt the professionals should get a different line of work if their conscience interfered with the morning after pill, etc.  Pharmacists were proscecuted if they refused to dispense medication contrary to their religious/moral views.


http://illinoisreview.typepad.com/illinoisreview/2008/12/illinois-pharmacists-not-required-to-distribute-morningafter-pill.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<!-- google_ad_section_start --><p>We just went through this in Illinois with pharmacists, the now embattled gov felt the professionals should get a different line of work if their conscience interfered with the morning after pill, etc.  Pharmacists were proscecuted if they refused to dispense medication contrary to their religious/moral views.</p>
<p><a href="http://illinoisreview.typepad.com/illinoisreview/2008/12/illinois-pharmacists-not-required-to-distribute-morningafter-pill.html" rel="nofollow">http://illinoisreview.typepad.com/illinoisreview/2008/12/illinois-pharmacists-not-required-to-distribute-morningafter-pill.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Always On Watch</title>
		<link>http://floppingaces.net/2008/12/19/bush-throws-down-gauntlet-for-obama-on-right-to-die-and-abortion-with-conscience-rule/comment-page-1/#comment-143461</link>
		<dc:creator>Always On Watch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 13:34:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=13834#comment-143461</guid>
		<description>Many healthcare workers today in America are Moslems.  I wonder how this &quot;medical conscience rule&quot; will affect the patient care they provide.

We already know that some Moslem doctors in the UK refused to use alcohol to sterilize their hands.   Fortunately, a UK court told them they were in violation of hygienic rules -- that is, for the violations the court knew about.

To my knowledge, some OBGYNS have always refused to perform abortions with no legal consequences.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<!-- google_ad_section_start --><p>Many healthcare workers today in America are Moslems.  I wonder how this &#8220;medical conscience rule&#8221; will affect the patient care they provide.</p>
<p>We already know that some Moslem doctors in the UK refused to use alcohol to sterilize their hands.   Fortunately, a UK court told them they were in violation of hygienic rules &#8212; that is, for the violations the court knew about.</p>
<p>To my knowledge, some OBGYNS have always refused to perform abortions with no legal consequences.</p>
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		<title>By: ICanCopyandPasteToo</title>
		<link>http://floppingaces.net/2008/12/19/bush-throws-down-gauntlet-for-obama-on-right-to-die-and-abortion-with-conscience-rule/comment-page-1/#comment-143443</link>
		<dc:creator>ICanCopyandPasteToo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 05:58:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=13834#comment-143443</guid>
		<description>Mo-Money Mo-Money Mo-Money

&lt;blockquote&gt;The Obama-Biden Transition Project posted a plan on its website called &lt;a href=&quot;http://change.gov/page/-/open%20government/yourseatatthetable/20081125_arrh.pdf&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&quot;Advancing Reproductive Rights and Health in a New Administration.&quot;&lt;/a&gt; It is signed by a coalition of 66 groups including Planned Parenthood, NARAL Pro-Choice America, the National Organization for Women and the American Civil Liberties Union.

The outline lists proposed steps for Obama&#039;s first 100 days in office including the following:

    * Increase funding for Title X (which funds Planned Parenthood) to $700 million from the current $300 million
    * Expand coverage of taxpayer-funded abortions under Medicaid
    * Promote sex education in schools and communities at cost of $50 million
    * Provide birth control at colleges
    * Expand taxpayer-funded abortions to federal employees, military facilities, the Peace Corps and federal prisoners
    * Increase funding for Title V Maternal and Child Health services to $850 million from $666 million
    * Provide international abortion providers with $1 billion
    * Increase funding for the CDC&#039;s school HIV and STD prevention programs from $40.2 million to $66.6 million
    * Increase funding for substance abuse and mental health services programs for pregnant women and mothers from $12 million to $70 million
    * De-fund abstinence only programs
    * Re-examine Bush administration policies that block or limit women&#039;s access to emergency contraception
    * Pass the Freedom of Choice Act
    * Select judicial nominees who &quot;demonstrate a commitment to justice civil rights, equal rights, individual liberties, and the fundamental constitutional right to privacy, including the right to have an abortion.&quot;

Obama&#039;s transition office is also trying to find ways to undo Bush administration policies dealing with abortion.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

What have we gotten ourselves into?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<!-- google_ad_section_start --><p>Mo-Money Mo-Money Mo-Money</p>
<blockquote><p>The Obama-Biden Transition Project posted a plan on its website called <a href="http://change.gov/page/-/open%20government/yourseatatthetable/20081125_arrh.pdf" rel="nofollow">&#8220;Advancing Reproductive Rights and Health in a New Administration.&#8221;</a> It is signed by a coalition of 66 groups including Planned Parenthood, NARAL Pro-Choice America, the National Organization for Women and the American Civil Liberties Union.</p>
<p>The outline lists proposed steps for Obama&#8217;s first 100 days in office including the following:</p>
<p>    * Increase funding for Title X (which funds Planned Parenthood) to $700 million from the current $300 million<br />
    * Expand coverage of taxpayer-funded abortions under Medicaid<br />
    * Promote sex education in schools and communities at cost of $50 million<br />
    * Provide birth control at colleges<br />
    * Expand taxpayer-funded abortions to federal employees, military facilities, the Peace Corps and federal prisoners<br />
    * Increase funding for Title V Maternal and Child Health services to $850 million from $666 million<br />
    * Provide international abortion providers with $1 billion<br />
    * Increase funding for the CDC&#8217;s school HIV and STD prevention programs from $40.2 million to $66.6 million<br />
    * Increase funding for substance abuse and mental health services programs for pregnant women and mothers from $12 million to $70 million<br />
    * De-fund abstinence only programs<br />
    * Re-examine Bush administration policies that block or limit women&#8217;s access to emergency contraception<br />
    * Pass the Freedom of Choice Act<br />
    * Select judicial nominees who &#8220;demonstrate a commitment to justice civil rights, equal rights, individual liberties, and the fundamental constitutional right to privacy, including the right to have an abortion.&#8221;</p>
<p>Obama&#8217;s transition office is also trying to find ways to undo Bush administration policies dealing with abortion.</p></blockquote>
<p>What have we gotten ourselves into?</p>
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		<title>By: Elektra</title>
		<link>http://floppingaces.net/2008/12/19/bush-throws-down-gauntlet-for-obama-on-right-to-die-and-abortion-with-conscience-rule/comment-page-1/#comment-143437</link>
		<dc:creator>Elektra</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Dec 2008 04:44:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.floppingaces.net/?p=13834#comment-143437</guid>
		<description>;) 

Thank you for articulating that. I thought you were surprised. *blush  lmao @ the fodder now...
Too old to live, too young to live. Same difference. Same evil.
GW has kept us safe in ways many may never understand. The effect of FOCA is far reaching. Catholic Bishops will close their hospitals before they take money from a gov&#039;t forcing them to kill. And never mind the people I see in gov&#039;t offices deciding what patients are viable. I&#039;m ectatic this challenges both issues.

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.usccb.org/comm/statisti.shtml&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;The Catholic Church in the United States At A Glance,&lt;/a&gt; 

HatTip:Ed Morrissey-HA</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<!-- google_ad_section_start --><p> <img src='http://floppingaces.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' />  </p>
<p>Thank you for articulating that. I thought you were surprised. *blush  lmao @ the fodder now&#8230;<br />
Too old to live, too young to live. Same difference. Same evil.<br />
GW has kept us safe in ways many may never understand. The effect of FOCA is far reaching. Catholic Bishops will close their hospitals before they take money from a gov&#8217;t forcing them to kill. And never mind the people I see in gov&#8217;t offices deciding what patients are viable. I&#8217;m ectatic this challenges both issues.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.usccb.org/comm/statisti.shtml" rel="nofollow">The Catholic Church in the United States At A Glance,</a> </p>
<p>HatTip:Ed Morrissey-HA</p>
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