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26 May
Skye Speaks on Assault by Peacenik
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Monday, May 26th, 2008 at 10:26 am | 108 views
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you have to wonder why the “peace” folks are usually the most violent, it seems that they are just very unhappy in everyhting and latch onto the most controversial thing to freak about. i also think they target women because we are the “weaker” sex, um, yeah right. tell the fat aging hippies to try 28 hours of hard labor, then child birht and get back to us on that one. they have to bully people to make themselves valid and to try and flex muscles that they are to afraid to put into service for our country. wow, i hope their mothers are proud of the wusses they raised.
Peace activist are nothing but cowards. They are the bully’s from school days that haven’t matured past that time. They also are so self important that no other opinion counts. We have all ran into these people sometime in our lives, and the only thing they want is their way. You stand up to these people, and you find that if it’s at all equal, they put their tail between their legs and sulk away.
Stellar interview and post, Mike.
skye is the absolute best!
Thanks Wordsmith. And both Skye and myself are still hoping to hear your thoughts on:
http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/05/21/the-cost-of-appeasement/#comments
What can I say that hasn’t been said in my previous threads?
I’ll read the post later (I only skimmed the comments, at your prodding).
Ummmm…. so you guys are criticizing people who act violently towards groups (meaning all of you) who openly advocate war which by definitiion means death and destruction on a massive scale, particularly when you preemptively attack a country….. okay that makes sense.
Did any of you watch the numerous testimonies from the Winter Soldier Two? In particular did anyone listen to Jon Turner’s testimony and watch the video and look at the pictures? Do you think only “good” comes from war? Are Iraqi civilians even important to any of you or jut US soldiers?
Just curious.
No. We’re criticizing those peace fascists who behave as anything other than “peaceful” and tolerant of diverging points of view.
We’re advocating for peace through victory. Tell us how America and Iraq would be better off by abandoning a fledgling democracy to chaos and al-Qaeda?
Do you think the suffering will be greater of lesser if we leave, prematurely?
I’d say 12 years was long enough. Saddam was a cancer upon the world. How much longer would you allow him to metastasize before offering up treatment? Better sooner or later? Was he a danger or not? Did we have justification or not?
Should I have?
Have you listened to the numerous soldiers who don’t agree with them, or you?
Do YOU think any good comes out of war?
Do you think our soldiers are terrorizing innocent Iraqis and children?
Do you not care about the children AND the soldiers?
Just curious.
Yes, I’ve seen horrible pictures, including a medicolegal forensic text showing graphic images of victims of blunt-force head trauma, gunshot wounds to the face and body, the results of edged weapons attack, etc.
Violence is horrible. But how do you stop violence against innocents? Hating violence and war is not the same thing as advocating for peace. Are we targeting innocent Iraqis, or are the insurgents, foreign fighters, and al-Qaeda terrorists the ones targeting them?
Oh….look….here are pictures of our soldiers terrorizing the Iraqi people:
Uh oh, that kid looks like he’s toast:
A schoolboy waves at a U.S. army soldier who is on a foot patrol in Baghdad’s Dora neighborhood. Hadi Mizban – AP
Any moment now, this soldier is going to open fire:
At least these kids are smart enough to run away:
Good heavens…this soldier is attempting to crush the girl to death in a lethal bear hug:
Uh oh….this kid is running away from the terrorist American soldier:
See? Best place to hide is behind the American soldier, where the soldier can’t see him.
Oh, how these kids hate our soldiers! They are taking revenge. Look:
These kids must be trying to rob the poor soldier of his wallet:
February 12, 2008: U.S. Army Staff Sgt. William Lambert, 30, of Plainview, Ark, shows photographs of his children to Iraqi children in Beijia, south of Baghdad. By Maya Alleruzzo, AP
These kids must be asking him to surrender his weapon:
REUTERS/Erik De Castro
According to Michael Yon:
Hating war is not the same thing as wanting peace. If you are opposed to suffering, war, and violence, you should support our efforts in Iraq:
A U.S. Army Soldier from Charlie Company, 4th Battalion, 9th Infantry Regiment, 4th Stryker Brigade Combat Team, 2nd Infantry Division, from Ft. Lewis, Wash., shares a laughs with an Iraqi army soldier at a U.S. and Iraqi Army security checkpoint in Tarmiyah, Iraq, Sept. 25, 2007. U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication 2nd Class Summer M. Anderson.
U.S. Army Sgt. Quenton Sallows hands out Iraqi Flags to Iraqi children beginning their first day of school in Lutafiyah, Iraq, Oct. 1, 2007. Sallows is assigned to Civil Affairs, 2nd Battalion, 15th Field Artillery Regiment, 2nd Brigade Combat Team, 10th Mountain Division (Light Infantry). U.S. Air Force photo by Staff Sgt. Quinton Russ.
Nice to Meet You
U.S. Marine Corps Cpl. Julia Venegas, from 2nd Marine Logistics Group, shakes hands with a little girl in the village of Kabani, Iraq, while on a security patrol Sept. 28, 2007. U.S. Marine Corps photo taken by Lance Cpl. Robert S. Morgan.
A U.S. Army Soldier of 1st Battalion, 38th Infantry Regiment, 4th Brigade Combat Team, 2nd Infantry Division plays with a young Iraqi boy in Mufriq, Iraq, Oct. 8, 2007. U.S. Air Force photo by Staff Sgt. Shawn Weismiller.
Iraqi girls walk to a primary school in the Andaloos district of Fallujah, Iraq, Oct. 17, 2007, to receive school supplies from U.S. Marines and Iraqi police. U.S. Marine Corps photo by Sgt. Robert B. Brown Jr.
The students at an elementary school in Jerf Al-Mila hold up their ‘Junior Hero’ stickers after taking an oath to become honorary Junior Heroes during a visit to the school by Iraqi Army Soldiers from the 3rd Battalion, 2nd Brigade, 9th Iraqi Army Division (mechanized), Oct. 17. The Junior Hero program was designed by the Iraqi security forces to teach children about the roles of the Iraqi Army and Iraqi police who work in their communities and ways in which they can volunteer to keep their villages free of crime. Photo by Staff Sgt. Jon Cupp, 1st Brigade Combat Team, 1st Cavalry Division Public Affairs
A Sucker for Children
U.S. Marine Corps Lance Cpl. Patrick K. Mason, a squad leader for 1st Platoon, Alpha Company, 1st Battalion, 7th Marine Regiment, hands a lollipop to an Iraqi boy during a security patrol in Dulab, Iraq, Sept. 25, 2007. The Marines are working with Iraqi police in support of Operation Iraqi Freedom in the Al Anbar province of Iraq. U.S. Marine Corps photo by Cpl. Shane S. Keller.
To be opposed to our presence and efforts in Iraq is to be standing in the way of history’s momentum; and on the wrong side of it.
Why yes, Brandon, Iraqi civilians are definitely important.
That’s why I’m glad that the rape rooms and the torture chambers and the wood chippers and the resulting mass graves are now a thing of the past. Let’s also not forget the dramatic decrease in infant mortality rates in Iraq.
Yes, sometimes something good does come from war.
Of course, if you really “cared” about the Iraqi people you would be cheering our efforts there and applauding our accomplishments. But that’s not where you are is it?
Let me ask you Brandon, the freedoms that you have and presumably enjoy, are those “good” things that came as a result of war or did those just fall out of the sky and land in your lap?
That didn’t take long. Now show the pictures of the brutality of war “wordsmith”. Show the dead bodies of Iraqis. Show the coffins of the returning US soldiers…oh wait you can’t because the a virtual black out by the media.
I’ve noticed a tendancy to only show the positive. And yes you should have listened to Jon Turners tesimony. He served in Iraq and speaks openely about atrocities perpetrated by US soldiers. His words not mine.
Link me up. I get visited on occasion by an anti-war blue star mom. We get along, even as we disagree. I’ve heard enough testimony from anti-war vets; I even have some anti-war milbloggers on my sidebar. Their perspective is important, but doesn’t mean it’s the only perspective, let alone the “correct one”.
Oh, I have seen them, Brandon. Some of the most grisly things that can be done to a human body. (and if you want to see the flag-draped coffins, just watch my Memorial Day videos)
But you still miss the point. Will those images cease, simply because we leave Iraq?
The absence of war is not the same thing as having peace.
Peace through victory? Your the type of guy who would kill 20 civilians to get to one bad guy. And Michael Yon? Please. Try Lara Logan, Nir Rosen or Michael Ware. Oh but that might contradict your Rosy assessment.
You’re obviously on auto-pilot and just spouting your preconceived beliefs without engaging exactly what I wrote in my comments.
Michael Ware, btw, said if we vacate Iraq prematurely, it’d be a bloodbath.
Murtha spoke out about atrocities too.
Of course, it turns out he was dead flat wrong.
I’m tired of guys like you ovestating Al Queda. As if a few thousand Sunnis could defaet a few million Shias. Oh and for the record, I have two friends, one of which served two tours in Iraq and the other in Iraq and Afghanistan . they both have differing opinions from yours but then again they’ve actually been there.
There’s no rosy assessment. It’s hard work. It’s not without pain and sacrifice from those directly involved.
But you anti-war folk wish to showcase flag-draped coffins not to celebrate their heroism and sacrifice; but to say they died a useless and meaningless death, and “gosh, how awful war is”. That doesn’t bring peace, buddy.
Who’s overstating their influence? You’re not understating it, are you?
It’s not necessarily a matter of numbers, but leadership in fomenting the chaos.
Yes, and I know vets of both theaters as well; and NONE of them share your defeatist ideology.
Wow my spelling stinks today. I can’t view the entire comment box so I can’t see everything
I’m writing which is why I have to break up my postings. That’s weird.
Defeatist ideology? Go back and read my original post. Finished? Good. Now where did I mention defeatism or withdrawal. Oh, I didn’t. You put words in my mouth. Is that your thing? You make stuff up?
Please all of you watch the testimonies of Jon Turner and others. Then we can have a conversation. My friends who served didn’t have a “defeatist attitude” as you put it. They just acknowledged that there are things over there that are beyond the control of our military.
One of the central problems with the Gov. of Iraq is corruption. My friend who served worked in Civilian Affairs. He deals with the various local Governments. He says that the idea of a central Gov. is unlikely considering that each group: Sunnis, Shias and Kurds do not want the other to have too much power. How do you solve that through Military?
Preconceived beliefs huh? Actually I’m one of those rare creatures (unlike you) who changes his mind when presented with differing views. I actually supported the invasion of Iraq but heh don’t let little things like facts get in the way of your argument. It is you who is on auto pilot.
Since you’re so good at twisting people’s words, would you rather just argue with yourself?
You have yet to get anything right about my opinions, but it’s fun watching you make stuff up. Next you’ll probably say I’m a Muslim or wait maybe I supported Saddam……fill in next insult………
You just keep delivering prepared rebuttals. If you want to know what I think perhaps you should ask because your assumptions about me are wrong. And you know what they say about people who assume……..
I mentioned the Iraqi civilians BECAUSE I feel that our Media ignores them. The 2 million displced Iraqis, the thousnds of dead men women and children. Why is it so wrong to bring this up? How does that make me a defeatist?
It’s been fun being insulted and having my words twisted by you Wordsmith. I’m sure if we met in person youd probably assault me or something equally scary. I’ve got to run. Maybe tommorrow I’ll let you insult me some more. I’m kind of on this “turn the other cheek” deal right now. Prayer has a powe4rful effect.
Rofl….testimony that was not given under oath. Worthless just like John Kerrys lies, these Winter Solder II lies are just as bad. If they are not lies then go under oath….simple as that.
You can’t be over the age of 12…..talk about retarded.
I wonder if this is the same “Brandon” that used to demonstrate such willing ignorance commenting at Mike’s America years back?
If so, we miss you Brandon. You’re always good for a laugh and it seems that time out of college hasn’t helped you to overcome the effects of the insidious brain washing you received.
I just hope you have been able to find good employment so you can afford to pay the taxes that your socialist beliefs demands is necessary to make you feel better about yourself.
Great article, great work on supporting our troops, and their impending Victory in Iraq (for proof check here – http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htiw/articles/20080527.aspx)
Save a seal, club a libtard
12 is the median mentality age of IVAW, Curt.
My good friends Jonn Lilyea and TSO have covered the WS proceedings and have exquisitely dissected their statements – NOT testimony.
Jonn’s POV:
Congressional Caucus Circus
http://thisainthell.us/blog/?p=1670
Last Word on WS – Check out the links from Rurik!
http://thisainthell.us/blog/?p=1420
Winter Soldier 2, My AAR:
http://thisainthell.us/blog/?p=1352
Oh Hell No!
http://thisainthell.us/blog/?p=1403
Check out Comment 6 of Jonn’s Oh Hell NO! post from Cliff Hicks (IVAW Puke)
6Clif Hicks Says:
April 7th, 2008 at 7:19 am
Mattera: “Would you go on the record as having committed war crimes?”
Hicks: “Oh, Hell no!”
Uh… I didn’t commit any war crimes, besides crushing a few civilian cars out of boredom… And as for the ‘wedding shooting’ that wasn’t a war crime, that was an accident, what reason would anyone have to sign any affidavit over that?
Anyway, I can’t speak for the rest of my comrades but as for me: Fuck you I ain’t signin’ sheeeeeeit!
-Clif
Jonn wrote: Then why, since the beginning of this whole thing, have you used the wedding incident and you killing the driver of a car as examples of US atrocities in Iraq? If you’re willing to do the right thing (which is what you claim your testimony at Winter Soldier is) then why aren’t you willing to do the LEGAL thing and put your money where your mouth is?
Now, suddenly crushing cars out of boredom is a legitimate use of US military power in Iraq. I’ve NEVER heard you say that the wedding incident was an accident. It’s always been presented as bloodthirsty revenge by those evil deranged paratroopers of the 82d.
I guess you wouldn’t sign an affidavit since your story changes to fit the audience.
Pretty much sums up the character of the membership of IVAW.
Nice, skye.
Ok.
Brandon’s original comment in its entirety:
Ok, read it a second time, and the first paragraph is just offensive as the first time I read it.
Lol…you go back and read what else you wrote, subsequent to your original post. What do you call it, when you’re rah-rahing Winter Soldiers and Jon Turner and testimony on atrocities committed by our soldiers; when you talk about flag-draped coffins and the bodies of innocent Iraqis. Are you saying we should prosecute this war more aggressively, and really go after the ones committing these acts of violence against the innocent Iraqis? No. You’re saying our soldiers are the ones committing these atrocities. Yes you are.
You want us to abandon innocent Iraqis to chaos and more suffering that would occur if we left prematurely. You basically piss away the sacrifice of all those who bled and died to achieve success. If I have your number pegged wrong, then correct me. Quit crying like an indignant bitch because you had your feelings hurt. Grow some thicker skin and quit playing the role of persecuted victim. You set the tone of the debate as much as I did. But typical, like Karen Porter, you see me as the aggressor and you the civil, rational, tolerant one.
Putting words in your mouth? Please. You did just as much. Go back and read your comments. Check out comment #20:
Sounds like you’re projecting my labeling “defeatism” from you, onto them.
You disrespectfully reject Michael Yon (who’s probably spent more time as an embed than any other reporter over there), not because what he says isn’t valuable, but because it doesn’t fit what you wish to believe. I, however, listen to Lara Logan and pay attention to what Michael Ware has to say. Do you bother to read Bill Roggio or Michael Totten? I don’t dismiss the “facts” as reported by Lara Logan and Michael Ware. They do important work. But what I reject is the liberal anti-war perspective filter those facts are sifted through. You can have two people see the same set of events, and their lens filter will shape it to how they understood and processed what the information entails. One might see the glass half empty. The other will see it half full. Which one is right?
Brandon #21:
Best comment you’ve left so far. Free of snide barbs and whiny complaints of persecution (“conservatives are so mean! They called me out on my BS”).
Yes, I’m being mean and uncivil. I admit it. You let me push your buttons. Apparently, you didn’t like my humorous sarcasm in my first comment to you. Put you in a sour-puss mood.
Now, back to your comment: Corruption is definitely a problem. And no, the military can’t solve their political problems, for them. But things definitely can’t move ahead without the security of a safe environment. Many Iraqis have lost their lives, trying to make things work with the new government. Insurgents- Baathists and Saddam loyalists, thugs, foreign fighters and al-Qaeda operatives have worked to wreck havoc and foment dissent to sabotage efforts of Iraq reconstruction and reconciliation.
Brandon #22:
Like I said, “preconceived beliefs”, like the one you have about me not being able to shift views.
In part, yes. Because what you typed out, for the most part, reads like the countless inane, pompous, moonbat comments we read on a daily basis. How am I to treat you as someone special, if you haven’t proved you’re different? You come in here, talking like you’re presenting some novel ideas, here. Been there, read that. Yet I’m still willing to indulge you.
No, not really. It’d be too much intellectual stimulation for my brain to handle. I’d probably lose that argument by winning, anyway.
Didn’t I ask you a series of questions early on, to get a sense of who you are? What happened? Sidestepped the questions? Conveniently ignored them? Moved the goal posts? Go back and reread my brilliant comment #7. My guess is, you skimmed past, because you weren’t interested in possibly engaging my points or learning anything new; just in rebutting and being hissy.
Ok, so tell me about yourself and what you’re about, so I don’t “assume”.
Are you a Paul Bearer (supporter of Ron Paul, like Adam Kokesh)?
Comment #23:
Gee…when you brought up Lara Logan, I assumed you’ve watched her pieces. I guess I did make an ass out of u and me.
Do you read the NYTimes? Washington Post? 60 Minutes? MAINSTREAM NEWS?!!! In what manner are they “ignoring” Iraqi civilians?
Much of which, I already know about because of the mainstream news; and what doesn’t go deep enough in coverage, I sometimes can acquire through alternate media.
But do you balance out the negatives with the positive stories? Or do you only gravitate toward the negative, the way you accuse us of leaning toward positive news stories?
You’re right: Bringing it up in and of itself doesn’t make you a defeatist. But in the context of how you brought it up, my assumptions about you, I’d say, were logical ones to make. If I’m wrong, prove me wrong. I’d be more than happy to apologize.
Comment #24
It worked both ways, didn’t it? The suggestion in your remarks is that we must not care about Iraqi children and flag-draped coffins. And that we criticize protesters for getting violent toward those who are pro-victory (or warmongerers, as you seem to like to characterize them).
So, going back to your original comment, do you condemn the violent action of John Meicht toward skye? Or condone it? Do you not see the sad humor and irony in “peace activists” using violence to get across their message of peace?
Oh, yes. I’m the conservative boogeyman.
Boo!
I really…..really……really am happy I was not drinking hot morning coffee as I read that.
You have a strange perception of your own self-worth as the persecuted saint of civility. Go back and read some of the tone and tenor of your comments.
Curt I can’t be over twelve huh? Ummm I believe you have a cartoon picture of a cowboy next to your name on this website so coming form you that means nothing. Now go back outside and play with you toy guns or something. I’m actually quite close to your age but again you guys like to make incorrect assumptions so I’m not surprised.
Wordsmith is a grownup; does he really need your help?
It’s just little old’ me. Do we really need the gang bang? Wordsmith can’t fight his own battles?
Wordsmith, the “turn the other cheek” comment was my lame attaept at sarcasm. If you remember the topic of discussion was about how peace protestors were violent so I was say I’ll turn the other cheek. The prayer thing, I’ll admit was dumb. So you got me there sport.
Mikey, I’m not the same Brandon. I’ve never read your website much less posted on it.
Fun fun fun. I’l be back. Wordsmith, think of a new way to draw incorrect conclusion. Lay off the Creatine.
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“Mikey”??? I see you want to engage in yet another example of lib civility?
How old are you Brandon?
Wordsmith
You’re absolutely right. I didn’t answer your questions, so now I will. I’ll address them point by point. N’kay.
Now you won’t have to make false assertions anymore and as a result would sound so ignorant.
“No. We’re criticizing those peace fascists who behave as anything other than “peaceful” and tolerant of diverging points of view”.
Peace fascists? Really. You might want to look up fascism. One of the characteristics of fascism is:
Powerful and Continuing Nationalism: Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing and in public displays.
Remember the woman in Skye’s video was calling the other guy a traitor because he didn’t support the war. Sounds fascist to me.
“We’re advocating for peace through victory. Tell us how America and Iraq would be better off by abandoning a fledgling democracy to chaos and al-Qaeda”?
At some point we have to let the Iraqis fend for themselves. Al Qaeda would be wiped out by Shia majority. Millions of Iraqis aren’t going to let several thousand Sunni Al Qaeda members run there country. That’s like saying that the Mob would take over the US. The Mob has money, weapons and power, but they could never take over and neither would Al Qaeda.
Silly man.
“Do you think the suffering will be greater of lesser if we leave, prematurely?
Depends, according to Michael Ware and Nir Rosen much of the ethnic cleansing has already taken place. However, I’m sure there would be more killing. The difference is WE wouldn’t be causing the death and destruction.
“I’d say 12 years was long enough. Saddam was a cancer upon the world. How much longer would you allow him to metastasize before offering up treatment? Better sooner or later? Was he a danger or not? Did we have justification or not?”
Absolutely we were justified. Next question!
“Should I have?”
Yes sparky, you should have. It’s important to see the horrors of war considering you’ve never been in one.
“Have you listened to the numerous soldiers who don’t agree with them, or you?”
Yes I have. Of course they think they can win. Would you want a soldier who didn’t think victory was attainable? The problem isn’t a military one as I pointed out, it’s political and unless those soldiers want to run for public office, there’s not much they can do to change that.
Do YOU think any good comes out of war?
Yes I do.
“Do you think our soldiers are terrorizing innocent Iraqis and children?”
Based on what I’ve read, been told, seen pictures of, I’d say some are. Not all but some.
“Do you not care about the children AND the soldiers?”
Absolutely I care about the soldiers. That’s why I want them home. they’ve done there duty, eliminated Saddam, his two sons, much of Al Qaeda. Why are we asking them to Nation build?
“Violence is horrible. But how do you stop violence against innocents? Hating violence and war is not the same thing as advocating for peace.”
Advocating peace through violence isn’t always the answer either. Sometimes peaceful means win; just ask Gandhi, Martin Luther King, Jimmy Carter (Egyptian-Israeli cease fire) and JESUS CHRIST.
“Are we targeting innocent Iraqis, or are the insurgents, foreign fighters, and al-Qaeda terrorists the ones targeting them?”
Ever heard of collateral damage? Some of those soldiers who testified, and my friend who served said civilians were sometimes were targeted. Again, THEIR WORDS NOT MINE. GOT THAT SPARKY?
And lastly a comment. You must be completely out of your mind if you honestly believe that soldiers never commit atrocities. The reason the Winter Soldiers didn’t testify under oath is because I’m sure they didn’t want to be charged with War crimes. In there eyes they were doing their duty. You know following orders. I’m sure you also believe that there is no such thing as police brutality.
How is fantasy land by the way?
Mike
I’m sorry that adding a Y to the end of your name is so upsetting. I apologize. MIKE, I’m not the same Brandon. Better?
Lib civility? Come on really? Are you and Sean Hannity roommates or something? I’m not a lib, or a Democrat or a traitor or a moon bat or whatever label you chose to try and categorize someone MIKE. If you wan’s to sound as ill-informed as Wordsmith, go right ahead. Otherwise ask me some questions before you throw around labels.
I’m 36.
I’ll tell you what Brandon, of the two of us, only one of us was at WSI. And one of us REPEATEDLY ASKED for more information from Mr. Turner. I’m still waiting on that. So how about you ask the name of the CO and XO, and then I will work on seeing that all the incidents are investigated? Fair enough? Still waiting on his sworn statements.
This was my take from there, and you will see that even then I was asking for more info:
http://3-116thsniper.blogspot.com/2008/03/john-micheal-turner.html
Thus Spake….ooh that’s just a silly name. So you were at the WSI, great. Are you suggesting that all of them are lying? Why would they lie? If you want to look into their statements go right ahead. Why don’t YOU let me know what you find out. I’m not a professional blogger who has loads of time to do resaerch.
Yeah you guys support the troops, only the ones who share your opinions. That’s the difference between us. I support all of them regardless of whether they have the same beliefs as I do. Whether they’re Democrat, Republican, Christian, atheist, black, white, red, yellow.
I’m not accusing our soldiers of atrocities; I’m simply taking THEIR word for it. I guess my friend is also a liar.
Wow, you guys really are out there.
N’kay?
I was there, and you apparently have no clue as to the derivation of my name, so why call it silly? It is from “Thus Spake Zarathustra” apparently something you have never read.
And no, I do not think they all lied. I do however think that most of the stories were exaggerated, and that 90% of them do not rise to the level of a “war crime.” I have repeatedly sought to address the validity of those remaining statements, but am still waiting on sworn statements from the parties involved on IVAW’s side, which allegedly will one day show up on line. In the meantime I contact other members of that unit. So far, I have been told by 3 specific individuals in Hurd’s platoon that his stories are lies. Do I know that to be the case? Nope. I trust no one implicitly until it is documented. Something his SGM was willing to do if we asked him to. But since Hurd has yet to testify under oath to any of this, what was the point.
So, some of the stories may be true. Wouldn’t surprise me if a few were. But atleast 90% are either ridiculous war stories the likes of which I could regale you with all day, or were straight up not true.
I doubt you are serious, but this stuff here will give you an idea of my take on the whole fiasco:
http://3-116thsniper.blogspot.com/2008/03/winter-soldier-hearings.html
For my first hand account of the hearings, go here:
http://3-116thsniper.blogspot.com/2008_03_09_archive.html
OK, my first well thought out comment got eaten.
1) You’re an asshat.
2) My name is a reference to a work by Nietsche you’ve clearly never read.
3) Happy to let you know what I find out when just one of them gives a sworn statement with names and facts etc. Since they have yet to do that despite repeated statements that they would, I can not.
4) You can however read my take here:
http://3-116thsniper.blogspot.com/2008/03/winter-soldier-hearings.html
If you want my first person account:
http://3-116thsniper.blogspot.com/2008_03_09_archive.html
As for whether they ALL lied, I have no idea since they don’t give enough info to verify. I do know that 3 guys in Hurd’s platoon and Company contacted me to say he was flat out lying. I also know that Massey changes his story ever 7 mins. Also, Camilo Mejia is also completely full of it, when one compares his statements in his book with his spoken statements, which I addressed here:
http://3-116thsniper.blogspot.com/search/label/Camilo%20Mejia
Should I go on?
OK, and now it posted twice.
See, I was nicer the first time.
Thus Spoke Anus
No I haven’t read Nietzsche, but clearly you have. Wow, because of that you must be twice as smart as the regular guy. I’m way out of my league because you read Nietzsche. I shouldn’t even respond because you might quote Nietzsche ….and I don’t know if my tiny brain could stand to listen to a pompous blowhard quote a boring German Philosopher…..aaaarrrrghhhhhh.
Asshat? I prefer Assclown.
Hey Mike, this your idea of civility?
Mike,
Great interview with Skye!
Skye,
It’s good to hear the full story and see the video of what happened back on March 22 and also how you got involved in the Chester County Victory Movement.
Thanks!
PS: Good job, Wordsmith!
You called my name silly, I merely pointed out the derivation.
Are you truly taking offense at asshat?
Love how you didn’t even feign to address a single thing I said.
“Thus Spake Anus” OMG that is just so funny and inventive. Holy Spongebob, someone quick get this guy a writing gig in hollywood.
Hurt feelings, they’re what’s for lunch.
GANGBANG……………….I’m gonna be sore in the morning.
You guys should start a gang. You could be like the Jets from West Side story. Can any of you sing and dance?
When you’re a jet……..badahbadah….now you sing…..now Curt……..Mike I can’t hear you….I know you have a silky smooth voice…..Anus, now you….yeah.
What do you want me too address? You were there and I wasn’t? I beleive you have the leverage. You’re saying that some of them are lying so I guess they’re liars.
Anything else?
Darnit. I can’t see everything I write because the comment box wont expand. I’ll have to type in word then transfer.
Did you get to this site when the short bus got lost this morning?
Stop drooling on the window and take the bike helmet off, you look ridiculous.
And you read Nietsche? No Anus I didn’t take the short bus, your wife gave me a ride.
It occurred to me someone as unfunny as you might not be married. So it was your Sister….no….mom….No? Short bus, why are you making fun of retarded people?
This website is ridiculous. I have been to tons of polictical websites, and this the only one I can think of where the “Authors” do a majority of the postings.
How boring.
Here’s an example:
Negative article criticizing Dems or Libs or whatever.
Comments:
I agree.
Yes sir so do I.
Great post you guys.
Yeah I loved it so much I want seconds.
Yeah!
Arguing with you just isn’t sporting. It’s like hunting at a petting zoo, fishing with dynamite, or finding a liar amidst the anti-war crowd.
Spoken like the pompous ass that you are. Now run along and read some Nietzsche. Who invited you into the mix anyway Anus? I believe I was talking too Wordsmith, but apparentl you guys enjoy ganging uo on a fella. How manly.
I meant “to”, damn.
Can I get a spell checker on aisle six? I’m up to my elbow in Anus and I keep mispelling my witty retorts. Also, he reads Nietzsche so watch out.
I’m a pompous ass? And who invited me? Who invited you? Skye mentioned me up above, I just came to see what was up.
If I could only convey to you how far off you are on the pompous thing. Go back to inventing friends who told you all the stories of how they killed people.
You’re reaching Anus. Inventing friends? Yeah that’s what I’m doing. Can I get a cartoon cowboy?
What’s your real name?
Real name Anus?
Wow. You really are something special, aren’t you?
That’s sixty posts, I think I’ve earned that set of steak knives. Soooo…..where do I pick them up?
No nothing special and neither is you. I don’t take you, this website or myself that seriously. Everyone has their own perception of what reality is. There isn’t just one reality, but many. That’s why ten people can witness the same accident and still have ten different view points. Did the accident happen in one specific way? Yes it did, but each individual is incapable of seeing it in the same light. It’s the same with politics and war.
This site is nothing more than individuals whose opinions are based on mutual interpretations of reality. That’s your reality but not necessarily mine. You join together to try and disprove any dissenting opinions, regardless of whether they are true or not. You will always view the world through your particular lens. As such, it is impossible for me to do battle with your preconceived notions. Just as it would be futile for you to attempt the same with me.
So where does that leave us?
As an example, you say that other soldiers are calling Jon Turner and the others liars. What if it is they who are lying to protect themselves and Jon Turner is the only one to step forward? Ever thought about that?
I suppose if a woman was gang raped by six individuals, all of whom denied it, despite some physical evidence, you’d believe them over her. I wouldn’t. I’d see it differently that’s all.
I think were at an impasse.
Brandon, first off a trick for you in posting. When you can not see all the text box and submit buttons, change to the “Default” or “Classic” layout. (You’re generally viewing in “Aspire”) Then you’ll be able to post all you want. You’ll find the ability to switch in the right side bars, scrolling down.
After you switch, and you don’t see the selections to switch back, just clean your cookies out under “Tools/Internet Options” and refresh. You will come back up in “Aspire” layout.
Now… to your comments:
It may be you who has a misunderstanding of fascism. If you go to even a simple online dictionary version, you’ll see:
Most make the error is assuming only what they perceive is extreme right constitutes fascism. Yet extreme left is also fascist.
Jonah Goldberg’s has a book, trying to undo the piss poor education pounded into the latest generations’ heads… of which you must be a victim of. His definition is perhaps the best I’ve seen.
Note what they both have in common. The notion that the state is above the individual, and that the state seeks control over every facet of personal life… healthy, financial, opportunity, etc.
National pride, such as flags, slogans, pins, are not a sign of fascism. No more than you are a fascist if you carry around a picture of your baby in your wallet. BTW, my parents are of the WWII generation, with Dad in the Army air corps. They were a generation proud of their country, and their unity…. exemplified by pledging allegience, flying flags, honoring veterans, and singing patriotic songs. Call that generation fascist in my presence and I promise I will deck you with all this ol’ lady is worth.
Then you said:
Yet for over three decades, that minority of several thousand Sunni/Baathist did just that. The minority with the weaponry ran the country, and controlled it with fear, mass murders, and psuedo-elections.
So the deaths are acceptable to you as long as we aren’t involved? Woof…. Another example of our self-absorbed, narcissistic society.
You are leaping from one extreme to the other here. The problem is a combination of military, political and economics. Their military must be able to function. This entails budget allocation and dispensing of funds for weaponry and supplies.
Their budget allocation system is a patch work of old Saddam/new Iraq permanent laws. The old corrupt regime who knew the money ropes, bureaucratic redtape and laws, blew town as they were little more than accomplices to Saddam’s thuggery. The new guys are still on a learning curve. Running a central govt isn’t an easy task to learn, as evidenced by our own after over two centuries.
Once they have a functional and budgeted military that’s supplied, the political comes easier. They are functioning politically presently, with no more battles and no less grid locked than our own Congress. If they did not battle it out in the Assembly, it would not be an Arab democracy. The key is to battle it out legislatively, and not in the streets. They are getting there… slowly but surely.
It remains the purpose of our military to be at their backs until they are self sufficient, funded and supplied. And significant progress has been made to their abilities, as seen in Basra and Sadr City… tasks that once would have had to be done only by coalition troops.
Our soldiers are not nation building. They are assisting a nation who is rebuilding itself… a nation filled with those who most have never known anything but oppression and fear. Your friends are correct. This can be won, and a new Iraq can emerge and grow. But not if citizens attempt to dictate foreign policy and Iraq’s future from their Lazy Boys in US suburbia.
Collateral damage is always regrettable. However collateral damage today compared to previous wars is considerably less. It will be impossible to have a war without some innocents being killed.
However it is not our soldiers targeting innocents as part of their warfare. Our numbers of fallen are still but a small percentage of the Iraqis who have fallen. As long as they feel their new country is worth fighting for, the US cannot deny an ally in the region assistance. Period.
No one suggests that our military doesn’t have some bad apples. As long as humans walk the planet, there are a$$holes in our midst. However it can safely be said that the majority of our military are superior in morality and intent to those that seek to thrust Islamic law onto a country who has voted for something else.
And stop calling the bad guys AQ… they are not the only enemy with which to be concerned.
No, I would believe the person willing to go on record. And as yet, I have seen no sworn statement from any of them. Have you?
And why would he step forward? Because everyone of them that comes forward y’all parade through the streets as heroes. When you start doing that for the guys that said “I just did my job over there” then that will make it all equal and I will put more credibility in their stories. Since you haven’t bothered to read my posts detailiing it though, I don’t expect you to know that statements from the IVAW Chair Mejia are self-disputing. For instance his “running a prison camp” where he was there for 6 hours in one interview, and 6 days in the next.
In your world with the tear in the time/space fabric, apparently both are possible.
Brandon: Could you limit yourself to one pithy comment in reply and avoid this minute by minute stream of consciousness rambling?
If you do have a point to make, it’s best to do so briefly in a well thought out comment.
Frankly, I doubt too many people will bother to read the disjointed replies you left above.
You basically lost any argument you might have wanted to make with the filibuster above.
Thus Spake… “combat veterans who could be in MENSA but choose to drink beer instead.” LOL
Hat’s off to you, guy.
Well thank you! We’re an odd collective of combat vets who just happened to have all served together at one point or another.
Mike’s A… I have to “log in” for editing? Well, I’ll give it a whirl here. Logged in now.
BTW, I have your response on this thread in my email, but it’s not showing up on my view on this thread here at the moment. How weird is all this???
Jonah Golberg? Doughy pant load you mean. I’ve read his take on fascism and it’s nothing more than political posturing. Sorry but that’s HIS perception.
I’ll do you one better:
Dr. Lawrence Britt (a political scientist and not a pundit) has examined the fascist regimes of Hitler (Germany), Mussolini (Italy), Franco (Spain), Suharto (Indonesia) and several Latin American regimes. Britt found 14 defining characteristics common to each:
1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism – Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing and in public displays.
2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights – Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases because of “need.” The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, long incarcerations of prisoners, etc.
3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause – The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial, ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc.
4. Supremacy of the Military – Even when there are widespread
domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized.
5. Rampant Sexism – The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated. Under fascist regimes, traditional gender roles are made more rigid. Divorce, abortion and homosexuality are suppressed and the state is represented as the ultimate guardian of the family institution.
6. Controlled Mass Media – Sometimes to media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation, or sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Censorship, especially in war time, is very common.
7. Obsession with National Security – Fear is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses.
8. Religion and Government are Intertwined – Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government’s policies or actions.
9. Corporate Power is Protected – The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite.
10. Labor Power is Suppressed – Because the organizing power of labor is the only real threat to a fascist government, labor unions are either eliminated entirely, or are severely suppressed.
11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts – Fascist nations tend to promote and tolerate open hostility to higher education, and academia. It is not uncommon for professors and other academics to be censored or even arrested. Free expression in the arts and letters is openly attacked.
12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment – Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws. The people are often willing to overlook police abuses and even forego civil liberties in the name of patriotism. There is often a national police force with virtually unlimited power in fascist nations.
13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption – Fascist regimes almost always are governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions and use governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and even treasures to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders.
14. Fraudulent Elections – Sometimes elections in fascist nations are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns against or even assassination of opposition candidates, use of legislation to control voting numbers or political district boundaries, and manipulation of the media. Fascist nations also typically use their judiciaries to manipulate or control elections.
Moving on.
I’m not addressing you point by point because it’s futile. I will say that I haven’t referred to all bad guys as AQ. I realize there are numerous militias (and militias within militias) and foreign fighters that make up the insurgency. Those are mostly national groups that simply want as out of their country. There is a difference between National and international terrorism. Oh and a lot of Iraqis and foreign journalists refer to the war as “the occupation.”
Just FYI.
Do I really have to go through this with six different guys? I addressed issues with Wordsmith several times so I’m not going to do point by point again.
Hey GUYS, why not just let one of you address my comments. You all basically think and believe the same thing so why not keep it simple.
Does it really take Wordsmith, Mike, Curt, Thus Spake Ortner, Aye Chihuahua, and MataHarley to argue with just me?
Talk about team spirit. Do you guys all feel safer in numbers?
And Mike, I was having a problem with your comments box but thanks for the concern about my pithy and disjointed replies.
Is that your idea of right wing civility?
One more thing, do you use gel or mousse? I gotta know.
And is that your real hair?
Okay that was two, but your hair looks weird in you picture.
I’m just saying.
Thus said:
“And why would he step forward? Because everyone of them that comes forward y’all parade through the streets as heroes”.
Who are y’all? I haven’t been to any parades lately but thanks for getting it wrong, AGAIN.
“When you start doing that for the guys that said “I just did my job over there” then that will make it all equal and I will put more credibility in their stories. Since you haven’t bothered to read my posts detailing it though, I don’t expect you to know that statements from the IVAW Chair Mejia are self-disputing. For instance his “running a prison camp” where he was there for 6 hours in one interview, and 6 days in the next”.
I have read SOME of your posts. I was remembering an event that happened between my brother and I when we were teenagers and our recollections of the same event had two different interpretations. Imagine that. Your reply did nothing to dispel that notion of differences in perception but good effort.
So you get every detail right when you recalling a story there guy? I find that hard to believe.
“In your world with the tear in the time/space fabric, apparently both are possible”.
Cute. Ummmm…..so my example (which has actually been used in studies) of different perceptions is not correct? Then why do cops sometimes say that eye witness accounts are often the most unreliable evidence? Could it be the difference in Perception?
Naw, that couldn’t be it.
You want so desperately to disprove these soldiers that it doesn’t matter what they say. Move on.
Geesh.
Still didn’t get that name.
1) You should have seen the slobbering over them at the Progressive caucus and at WSI. No parade, but hero worshipping their “courage” nonetheless.
2) When stating that an event “changed your life” one would properly be expected to remember if said event (which occured 4 years ago) transpired over 6 hours or 6 days.
3) Perception is all fine, but you think that these stories can all be chalked up to perception? You either killed an old lady with a Mk19 grenade launching machine gun, or you did not.
4) If soldiers are guilty of these things, I want them punished, if these are lies, I want the liars silenced. Since all of us in uniform are maligned by these stories, true or not, I want the veracity confirmed or debunked.
Brandon, I will say this, I have a son older than you, and thank heavens he was not raised with your manners. Or do you only lose civility skills when you sit behind a keyboard?
I see you ignored the Merriam dictionary definition and decided to choose your own source. His article was his opinion of what regimes had in common. It does not constitute a definition, but does reflect his views. Oddly enough, not even an original thought for one purported to have a PhD. It was based on a prior article called Hallmarks of a Fascist Regime… located on Hippy.com. BTW, next time just post the link. Easier on us all.
Britt’s “14 Characteristics” was published by Free Inquirty magazine, the medium of the Council for Secular Humanism. A flashy organization of globalists who apparently use science as their God, and demonstrates strong tendencies (if not outright) to be aethiests… all of which may explain your tasteless “prayer” humor earlier, and your penchant for accepting one poly-sci pundit’s opine over another’s. If you think he is operating without an agenda, you are the fool you appear.
Why not wander back over to blatherwatch, Sparky.. where your insights are heralded as nothing less than magnificent? Talk about only getting along with those that are in accord…. can you say “Pot, kettle”?
BTW, Mike’s A… still having problems editing. Screen either:
1: redraws with a black veil and locks up or
2: just locks up
Bizarre… was just fine yesterday. I should try a reboot next…
“Oddly enough, not even an original thought for one purported to have a PhD.”
Brandon claims to have one? And he called me pompous?
Oh well, I mean I do have a JD, but come on!
Lawrence Britt with the PhD, Thus Spake… I think we can tell by Brandon’s scribblings and focus he doesn’t possess that diploma. However Britt’s article was a takeoff of the Hippy.com article. That’s why I said, not even an original thought. Just used bigger words and less weed to get his point across, I guess… LOL
Edit Problem Updates: I rebooted. Still the only way to edit is to open the new “Click to Edit” icon in a new browser. When I try opening it in the same window, same “black veil” look or merely a freeze for awhile. I’ve tried this in all layout versions,
BTW. All the problems started when this new “Click to Edit”/Ajax Edit comments icon appeared instead of the post getting highlighted when you click on it. I wondered if it’s a pop up blocker, but nothing appears at my menu bar to say anything is getting blocked…. oh well.
So does anyone want to take those 14 Characteristics of Facism and show examples of the Democratic party in action so that only one person will address Mr. Asshat? I’m sure most of the points could be addressed here in the archives of FA.
Oh, thank god.
Count me out, Udder. I’d find a hang nail more worthy of attention.
So you guys are seniors? As far cas manners go Thus, offering a first name is good manners. Still hiding behind your Monikers and still ganging up on little old me. How brave you both are.
Haha, I hear you Mata. I’ve been watching and laughing. I need to go to voice blogging or something. By the time I get everything researched, typed and formatted, it is old news.
Brandon #30 to Curt:
When you act like a 12 year old, it’s a logical assumption to make, no?
What is this? Westside Story? Are we rumbling?
Brandon #35:
Thanks for not making me sound ignorant. Couldn’t do it without you.
Yeah, yeah, yeah….you’re not the first to point out the definition of “fascism”. I’ve done it myself. You just don’t like my clever play on words.
Fascists also suppress dissenting views through aggressive tactics, and champions “cults of unity, energy and purity”. I’d say not all peace activists are peace fascists; but for the Karen Porters of the anti-war movement who are intolerant of opposition views and resort to aggressive means to stifle the voices of those opposed to them, it’s an apt term.
It’s inflammatory, sure. But a verbal slur/insult/name-call should not be met by a proponent for peace, by attacking a woman who was not the one calling him traitor.
So, my question again to you is: Do you condemn or condone his physical assault on skye?
Agreed!
You don’t think the Iraqis have been trying to do just that? Fend for themselves? Many of those thousands you lament have been those serving in the Iraqi government, in the police and security forces, fighting for the soul of their country against those have nothing to offer, except chaos and discord.
Do you think after 30 years of living under a brutal dictator, a traumatic insurgency that disrupts rebuilding activities, we’re going to sew stability over night? Apparently, some Iraqis actually thought just that: that the U.S. was so powerful, we could just magically snap our fingers and create daffodils and fuzzy bunnies and prosperity.
It takes about 4 years for our best officers to be trained at West Point. All officers must have a minimum of 4 year degrees. It takes Iraqi officers 3 years of training before they can join the force. We’ve been in Iraq for 5 years.
You might be right. But if we’re responsible for “creating the mess” and misery in Iraq, how dishonorable, how irresponsible would it be to pack our bags and go home? Would the suffering increase, or decrease?
And how does even a perceived defeat, make America safer? bin Laden gained notoriety and “jihadis” from his perceived victory at the Lion’s Den over the Soviets in Afghanistan. Nothing quite like the perception of success to up the recruitment.
Breath mint?
Is that what we are doing? Causing death and destruction? Who blows up mosques, hospitals, schools and delivers carbombs and homicide bombers into market places? And which side is working with the Iraqi government to rebuild the infrastructure to make life better for all Iraqis?
So you still believe in the invasion; just not the occupation? Then you are in agreement with the original plans of Rumsfeld and Bush, which was to model Iraq after Afghanistan. Officials within the CIA and State, however, diverged from the one pushed forth by the White House and Pentagon.
There’s merit in that. But what makes you think I don’t already realize just how awful war is? That I lack the ability to empathize? What do you say to those who have been in war, yet are opposed to your views? They aren’t here at the moment to speak, so you’re stuck with me.
Have YOU been in a war?
Then you haven’t really been listening to them (those who disagree with you). It goes beyond just those soldiers who are optimistic of their own prowess and who are fortified by a warrior’s will not to give up.
Without the military, in the face of insurgents and saboteurs who don’t want to see Iraq democratized, the hopes of political conciliation to push forward goes from having a chance, to not having a chance.
Again, reality is that even in the absence of an insurgency, rebuilding a country is an enormous challenge that won’t happen overnight. The Iraqi parliament has passed more legislation than our own 110th Pelosified Congress.
Good. Now I know I’m not dealing with a pacifist.
Out of around 150 thousand soldiers, the percentage of atrocities being committed are…..? What? And are we prosecuting them? Do the actions of a few delegitimize our NOBLE efforts in Iraq?
Historically, our military has often found itself in nation-building, governmental roles. This goes for small wars, not just the big ones.
You’re right: Mission was accomplished. But things don’t occur in a vacuum. One of our biggest mistakes in Afghanistan, was to leave behind a vacuum for the Taliban to fill, after the Soviets left.
The responsible thing, is to pick up where life leaves off. The original post-war plans did not iron out. Following the pottery barn rule, since we “broke it”, we have an obligation to “fix it”. Which is better for America: leaving behind a successful, stable Iraq, or leaving it behind in ruins? If you think America’s standing and image in the world was harmed by the Bush Administration, how would we look then? How does abandonment and the perception of defeat make America any safer from encouraging the bin Laden charge that America is a paper tiger who hasn’t got the intestinal fortitude to sustain the losses needed in order to win wars and win battles? Stalin pointed out how America couldn’t subdue little Korea, and after a few thousand dead, we were already weeping.
The strategic goals of democratizing Iraq was ever a gamble. But if it succeeds, if we have the will to withstand the setbacks and hardships, what are the potential ripple-effect rewards? It’s a story without an ending.
Of course. But have we truly been practicing cowboy diplomacy? I think John Bolton stated things very well, here:
I’d say 12 years of an extended war was long enough, and you apparently agree with me.
Since violence hasn’t ceased in Iraq, post-war, how do you think that the methods of “Gandhi, Martin Luther King, Jimmy Carter (Egyptian-Israeli cease fire) and JESUS CHRIST” would fair in dealing with former baathists, insurgents, criminals, foreign fighters (including Iranians), al-Qaeda, and Islamic holy warriors? Do they wish to sit down with the peace pipe and talk?
We have negotiated, where negotiations are appropriate and applicable (re: Sunni Sheiks, Salvation Fronts and Concerned Citizens).
Momentum’s on our side right now. Why snatch defeat from the jaws of a possible “victory”?
Lol…you must mean business when you find it necessary to type in capslock.
I’m sorry, but I’m deeply skeptical of the motives and clarity of the IVAW soldiers to make an assessment of the overall geo-political strategy of our presence in Iraq, in part due to some of what skye and Ortner have stated. Assuming the veracity of their “testimony”, anecdotal experiences don’t always see the bigger picture.
Were John Kerry and his Winter Soldiers honest as well as accurate regarding Vietnam? And was it a good thing, that they got what they wanted, by having us abandon our South Vietnamese allies, the way we did? What were the repercussions? How did it affect America’s image and standing? Were we honorable in our abandonment, after signing a written pledge to offer military support, should North Vietnam not honor their pledge agreement, and invade the South?
Now who’s trying to put words in who’s mouth?
My sense, is that those like yourself are quick to Murthafy Marines before they’ve been given their day in court. Quick to suspect the worst, and last to give our soldiers the benefit of the doubt.
So yeah, I’m suspicious of the Scott Beauchamps and Jesse MacBeths.
From where I’m standing? Looks overpopulated with moonbats. How’s it feel being there?
Brandon #38:
No; just a 36 year old who has an inordinate amount of time on his hands.
Brandon #39:
This is part of why it is so amusing that you seem to paint yourself as a “free-thinker”. Did you take the time to actually research skye’s links or the merits of Ortner’s points addressed in his link? No. Just childish belittling of his user handle.
You willfully ignore the ones who don’t speak of atrocities, but are all too willing to believe the ones who do speak of it.
Do you feel those atrocities are epidemic? Or aberrations that deserve 31 consecutive frontpage stories in the NYTimes, ala abu Ghraib?
Are you giving the issue proper perspective and weight? Or holding a magnifying glass to a blemish, to make the Arab world see nothing but our blemishes?
Ortner #40:
I doubt Brandon is serious. He doesn’t strike me as one after the truth, but one holding a partisan agenda. Otherwise, he’d welcome your links and disagreement, rather than deliver irritated insults. Case in point:
You’re a real piece of work. This is another example of your incivility and questions as to your age. Ortner brought up Nietzsche, because you made an unnecessary attack on his username, rather than engage him on the substance of his comment.
Brandon #46:
Yeah, we’re tag-team wrestling here. Grow up! You’re commenting on a conservative blog with multiple authors and….*gasp*…conservative readers. People are free to comment as they please. This isn’t a one-on-one rumble in the bronx. But I’m sure it makes you feel good to play up your persecution-complex. You stepped into it, so you deal with it. I’d love to pair you up with Philly Steve, though. You two would make quite the dynamic duo.
Brandon #47:
And you’re the one who told me I’ve never been in a war, so my opinions are supposedly worthless ones to have. Rather than crawl into your shell, engage Ortner on the substance of his links.
Ortner #49:
LMAO!
Brandon#52:
You obviously haven’t been around here before, have you?
Brandon #63:
So basically, you’re just parroting what I pointed out early on. Thank you.
Mike #66:
Yes, Brandon….try and be more like me.
I know it’s rather ambitious, but the joy is in the journey, not the destination, which we know is beyond your reach to attain.
Not that I expect you to address me in the future, Brandon, but to you, my first name is “Maam”… the same address you should use if you pass a stranger on a narrow street. Thank you for asking.
So umm…does this make your penis larger or just make you think it’s larger. Again just curious.
Mataharley, I am honestly sorry if I offended you. It’s not my thing to pick on a woman. I thought you were a man (wrong assumption-see Wordsmith I can admit when I’m wrong) I won’t address you rudely anymore. I’ll save it for the men.
What do you want? A medal?
Does it matter? So far you’ve been shooting blanks.
Wordsmith, are you a woman too? And no I don’t condone what happened to Skye. That jerk was way out of line. Picking on or assaulting a woman is never okay with me.
I’ve been shooting blanks about as long as long as you have which would be what…….about ten years now? Seriosly, answer the penis question. I’m childish? This website ius liitered with cartoon cowboys. I thought this was achildren’s website at first. Do you guys have nicknames for each other?
So that explains your presence here. Run along, now, junior. When you turn 37, maybe you’ll finally experience puberty.
When did this turn to talk of penises?
Is “penises” the plural of penis? Should it ever be pluralized?
This whole thread turned as gay as Lance Bass and Liberace dancing the macerena while Brandon drooled in the corner.
Oh come now wordsmith, you didn’t write that all by yourself did you now? You used that walkie Talkie to get help from the other cowboys didn’t you? Come on admit it. Experience puberty, gosh that’s original.Back to your penis………
Quit obsessing over my penis.
Turning childish was Brandon’s way of making a graceful exit from the substance put forth. It’s his way of “saving face”, without actually waving a white flag and admit he’s not interested in engaging you, or I, or anyone else on substance.
Lance who? You’re right I’ll stop talking about how small Wordsmith’s penis is. It’s just that big tough guys like him are usually overcompensating for something. Maybe he’s just really short.
Is that your perception of me from everything I wrote? “Big tough guy”?
Says more about you than me.
No it’s my way of saying I’ll address one of you and not six or seven. Trust me I’m could care less about saving face with any of you. You actually addressed some of the same things the rest of the cowboys did. How many times do I need to have the same argument? How many times do I need to be asked the same questions.
The difference between you and me is that unlike you I don’t need a posse to back me up. Unlike you I don’t hide behind a Moniker and unlike you I have a set of balls.
N’kay.
No one’s hiding behind “a posse”. You’re just too much of a moron to understand how this works: people leave comments, people are free to address said comment. It’s as simple as that. No one’s calling backup; the only one behaving like a whiny bitch is you.
Stay classy Brandon.
You’re an excellent representative of your species.
“Brandon” is as good a moniker as any. Give me your last name. Give me your address and phone number.
It’s far easier for you to find out who I am, than the other way around.
Prove to me that your raisins are the size of grapefruits. Quit hiding behind the name “brandon”.
No, that’s how your profile describes you:
“Currently a personal trainer and gymnastics instructor, wordsmith is looking at a career change into the military.”. I thought that made you sound like a tough guy. You aren’t?
Brandon, where is your blog?
Since this is Wordsmiths, I love how you just come in, make yourself at home and start making up rules.
And what the hell is “N’kay.”
If it’s a South Park reference to Mr. Garrison it is M’kay.
You aren’t Mr. Slave or Mr. Hand are you?
Wordsmith
Why do you want my name and address? Are you gonna track me down and hurt me? You post your name and adress first. Thanks Aye, your a class act yourself. I guess.
I sense penis-envy.
You’re able to dig through my profile, research from there….yet somehow I’m the one hiding.
Watch out, apparently Brandon knows how to wrestle:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDeodM9WhLk&feature=related
You asked me to stop “hiding” behind a moniker. And you’re not hiding behind a generic name, “brandon”?
Like that takes balls to comment, essentially, as an “anonymous with a name”.
How do you know my name isn’t Brandon. I didn’t ask for your entire name, address and phone number. You could just offer a first name.
Personally, I don’t give a damn what your name is. As seems your habit, you miss the point and context.
How did my video wind up on Youtube? I’m so embarrassed.
It’s been a lot of fun and I’m going to miss you all, especially you Wordsmith…or whatever your name is. All good fun must come to an end. I have other responsibilities besides annoying Alpha Male Conservatives.
You guys can dish it out but you sure can’t take it. I’m taking hits from all sides. Seven on one. Go back and read the sheer volume of insults. Am I getting upset? No.Why? Because none of this matters. It’s all folly.
And no that’s not a South Park reference. It’s something I did with my brother as a child.I don’t watch much TV; it’s such a brain drain. I read mostly, and aggravate Conservatives and some Liberals.
I gotta run, the Mother ship is calling me home.
I’d be willing to bet he did other things with his brother as a child too.
Exuent Brandon while “Do you really want to hurt me?” plays in the background….
So, getting back to the original subject…
Mike, great interview with Skye!
Skye, it was good to read and see the full story about what happened on March 22.
BTW, the lefty troll the we had visit the RC Pirate Forum on the RochesterConservative.com website tried to paint us as redneck racists and then posted about raping our wives and daughters while posting pornography.
The lefties can justify this behavior because they believe that the end justifies the means in advancing their agenda. They don’t want dialog…
Thanks RV. I know Skye wanted to share her story with readers earlier, but the legal process took precedence.
Oh, and I am not surprised at the vile lefty you had visit your site. This the consequence of being anointed with “absolute moral authority” as Maureen Dowd did with Cindy Sheehan and the anti-US-defense loons.
That absolute moral authority corrupts as surely as absolute power.
And it leaves so many of these lefties with more bile than brains.
Hate kills and lefties are killing themselves with it.
Way to hand the Brandon asshat it’s hat.
http://www.political-humor.org/graphics/how-about-a-nice-cup-of-shut-the-fuck-up.jpg
The photo montage of American soldiers was a slamdunk.
Bravo.
Mike, great interview with Skye! I’ve stood with her on the streets of DC, and I look forward to taking on gutless, hate-filled, anti-military extremists with her again in the future!
Actually, I’ll be in West Chester with her and the rest of the Sheepdogs on 6/14!
Paul: I envy you being able to participate in the VICTORY movement firsthand. When I was living in DC we didn’t have too many opportunities to show the colors like folks do now.
Give Skye a big hug for me when you see her!